Sell or NOT? Tips and Insights To Decide To Launch a New Product or Not with Emma Schermer Tamir

Michael MicheliniBusiness, Podcast0 Comments

Start Selling A Product Or Not? The big burning question is – deciding If You should even enter a specific product. This is such a common question sellers have – how to decide which next product to focus on. Let’s listen to Emma Schermer Tamir, the Co-Founder and Chief Creative of Marketing by Emma as she gives insights and what factors to consider when launching a new product.

Topics Covered in this Episode

  • Intro Emma

  • How her trip to China went

    How was your China Trip!? Share about that rat in the ceiling story!

  • How to know what product NOT to sell

  • Stage 1 in deciding to sell a product or not

    Knowing your customer avatar

  • Offline ways to get customer feedback and find the right market

    Common tips are always going online and searching – but why not get outside!

  • Getting permission to ask in stores

    Go to the store that sells your product and get ideas

  • Deciding If Your Product is different enough

    What ways can we feel confident if we are selling a good product

  • Analyzing the current listing marketplace

    Thoughts behind deciding how competitive the listings are by browsing

  • How often to optimize a listing

    What should we be doing and how regularly?

  • Deciding when there is no more room for optimizing

    Is optimizing a listing ever over?

  • Connecting with Emma

    How to get in touch.

People / Companies / Resources Mentioned in this Episode

Episode Length 51:20

This has been great. Thank you so much, Emma. It’s been awesome. She’s so supportive and really always been really fun to talk to. Hope listeners enjoyed this episode.

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Listen on Youtube

Show Transcript


[00:00:00] Episode 284 of Global From Asia, talking about factors to decide launching a new Amazon product and Emma’s running with Iraq and China. Let’s do this. Welcome to the Global From Asia podcast, where the daunting process of running an international business is broken down into straight up actionable advice. And now your host, Michael Michelini. Thank you. Everybody should

[00:00:30] rename the intros talking in the backseat of a Grab. Although it will be the last time in a Grab or a little while. Preparing to fly back to mainland China. If you’re on my newsletter, you may have heard me getting nervous about it and I’m getting some positive support from the sub- readers, so thank you for the positive support. Somebody said I should try to find some relationships at the border. 10 might always help. All right, and talking about borders, we had Emma.

[00:01:00] Emma is our guest today from Marketing by Emma. Such as sweet. Well men, and it was really a pleasure. She shared at the cross border summit our first time to China. We’re talking quite a bit, preparing for her coming, working on visa letters and border crossings and husband coming and all kinds of stuff. It was a, it was a great time to get nowhere and we tried to record this during the event or during their time in Hong Kong and Shenzhen and Guangzhou and all that craziness is. Those

[00:01:30] that have done that before? No, but we got to do this afterwards. While I was in Taiwan, actually, we are all over the place here and we actually, I wasn’t sure if she’d be down or open to talk about her rat running in China, but it’s part of the adventure and she does share about that on the interview today. At the end of the show. As always in our blah, blah, blah session. We will talk about some of the other crazy

[00:02:00] stories I’ve had in China, maybe with restaurants and a vermin. All right, so without further ado, let’s listen to Emma and get some insights about deciding if you should launch this new property or not, which is important, especially after a great Q4. I hope while you have some money in your banks and want to invest in some new products, let’s listen in. I know everybody is so excited about the Cross Border Summit. Seems like it doesn’t. All I hear about everybody’s asking me, when’s the next one?

[00:02:30] They want a sponsor. They want to speak. They want to attend. Thank you so much. It is. It is going to be, our main focus has always here Global from Asia, you know, always at least a couple of days. Most likely Chiang Mai, most likely mid November, 2020 stay tuned for more updates. Get on our email list at is probably the best way to find out, or we’ll probably just share on this show soon.

[00:03:00] Okay. Thank you everybody for tuning in to our Global From Asia podcast. We have with us somebody that’s been on my list for a while. I’ve tried to do it in person, but it was such an intense couple of weeks in October while we got her on. Finally, Emma Sherman, Tamir, she is the founder and basically the the woman behind the, behind the computer and also at our all our events from marketing by Emma. Emma, thanks for coming on. Hey

[00:03:30] Michael, thanks for having me. I’m glad that we managed to finally get this scheduled and worked out. Yeah. Yeah. We made it happen. I know. We’re both the people in that. Yeah. I mean the, and came out to the cross border summit. It was really amazing to have you, you share and your first time into China and or Asia or. Yeah, first time to China, first time to Asia first. Lots of firsts. Great. That mean that means things are exciting, right? So,

[00:04:00] um, keeping things on the edge. I feel that’s what we have to do here in life. So, yeah. I mean, we’re going to talk about, listen, you know, of course your specialty content writing, e-commerce, writing, you, Amazon and some other topics. But I just thought we excuse a little bit of fun stuff about. Some of your experiences, uh, in China if you’d, if you’d want to share a little bit. Definitely. So it was really interesting to be so far out of my comfort zone. I’ve

[00:04:30] actually. For a lot of my life, I’ve been very attracted to living abroad and I, I’ve lived on a few continents, but had had been a while since I been out of my comfort zone in that way. And I, when you mentioned that just now, it really, uh, kind of touched a, a warm spot in my heart because I feel like that’s so important, uh, for self development and for business development, you know, to be in such a.

[00:05:00] A foreign environment really got my brain thinking about so many different things. And I love the challenge of almost feeling like a child and needing to figure everything out, you know? So it’s not even simple to withdraw money from an ATM. If you have only Western cards in China, and getting a taxi can be a little bit of a adventure, maybe more of an adventure than I would have preferred. But, uh, it was a great time.

[00:05:30] And your summit was awesome and there was a little bit of a road show because then a lot of us were also attending some of the other events going on around that time. Global Sources and Chris Davie’s meet up. And so it was just amazing. Uh, I’d love to do it all over again one day. Yeah, I know. It’s an intense time. And. Yeah. Trade season is always, is always intense. Um, we can cut this part, but I don’t know if you want to share the story about the, you know,

[00:06:00] there was a couple of crazy stories you had. I don’t know if you want to share about the the ceiling thing or

[00:06:08] I, uh, I can’t say that I’m the best storyteller about things like that, but I will give it a shot. Yeah, let’s do it. Let’s do it. So we were at Chris Davies meetup, uh, before going to Hong Kong. And my husband is, is he, he’s my business partner. Also he’s is very much

[00:06:30] a networker and wants to take every opportunity that there is to meet as many people as possible. So we didn’t have time to eat before the event. And he’s like, Oh, well, we can eat something there. And of course that never ends up happening. And so it was probably close to 2:00 AM and I was. Starving and getting a little bit grumpy. And of course, by that point, the bar wasn’t serving food anymore and almost everywhere was closed. So I went on a little bit of an expedition and I found somewhere that looked

[00:07:00] decent enough and are my now good friend Peter, who I think you’ve just recently had a show. He, uh, agreed to help me navigate the all Chinese menu to, otherwise I would have been totally lost. There were no pictures or anything. So we order everything and we pay and. We’re waiting for them to prepare food, and all of a sudden there’s just this loud bang and the ceiling

[00:07:30] of the restaurant collapses. Everybody just keeps on going about their food prep. There’s no acknowledgement that anything bizarre happened, uh, they don’t seem to be troubled in the least. And the way that I’m sort of wondering whether this has happened. Before. It was also right next to a nightclub. So I think that the loud bass perhaps, um,

[00:08:00] and then of course, uh, above one of those ceiling tiles that was precariously hanging right above where they were preparing our food was a dead rat. So that was a little bit off putting, but I’d already paid and ordered. So I’m like, okay, we’ll just take the food, but I could not get myself to eat it. My husband did eat it. Even knowing that there had been a dead rat probably all over ensued. Uh, and somehow I was the one that woke up not feeling well in the

[00:08:30] morning. So I guess a few, a few smatterings of ceiling and rat does a body good. See, I don’t know, whatever doesn’t kill you only it makes us stronger. But then some people have modified that and said, just slowly kills you. Most people’s responses are you. Just because you don’t see that at other places doesn’t mean that you’re not also eating those things. So I think it’s one of those,

[00:09:00] I would just prefer to, uh, you know, let that surprise linger and not necessarily have it smacking me in the face that there’s this disgusting cleanliness standards. Yeah. Well, thanks for sharing. All is, and wasn’t sure if you would like to, but I think, you know, we like to add some of the little flavor, not rat flavor, but little flavor in a podcast, but before we get too technical. And then, yeah, you had a grease, you had a

[00:09:30] great talk, uh, at the summit and you know, there’s so much you could share here, but I thought we were chatting before the recording and I liked your idea of like how to know not to sell a product before he even work on optimizing your listing and creating your copy. And that can be maybe a good start. Sure. So one of the things that I really always want to encourage anybody that we’re working with, or even just interacting with is you want to be very clear about who you’re selling

[00:10:00] to and what you’re selling and what your differentiators are and sometimes asking yourself all of those questions before you get into the trenches with having an order of products and all of those things. Um, maybe you’ll actually find out that that’s not the right product for you to be selling. And it’s great to know that on the front end when you’ve invested far less time and money, then getting into something and realizing that it’s overly competitive and,

[00:10:30] um, and it’s just going to cost way too much to even be able to get a little bit into the game. Um, and, and that’s okay. You know, I think that it’s sometimes people, I don’t know that it’s, if they forget, but I think particularly in spaces like Amazon and online businesses. We forget that these are still businesses. And so when it’s a business, we’re going to make mistakes. And there’s such a

[00:11:00] steep learning curve, you know, you need to learn everything from sourcing and all of the challenges of that to all of the analytical side of PPC and keywords and marketing and, and product design. I mean, it’s just so multifaceted and none of us are good at all of those things, but I think that if you start off by really getting clear about who it is that you’re trying to serve with the product or your brand, then you can really set yourself up for

[00:11:30] a higher likelihood of success with a product. Great. Yeah, I agree. I think sometimes if you can avoid, avoid the mistakes before even get into them. Obviously that’s, that’s a lot people always say about how to make more money, but sometimes how to save money or avoid, avoid, uh, the losing, losing products. Um, what, what, where was somebody start with something like that?

[00:11:58] You can just start to think about really who your customer is. So it, particularly if you’re looking to establish a brand, I know that some people ride that train of, of doing the product research and, and their brand is really, um, less than the brand and more of just a interesting combination of products under one, uh. Businesses umbrella. But for those that are looking to establish a brand, I would say really start to think about who your customer is and get very, very clear about

[00:12:30] that. So a lot of people in marketing will do something called, um, they’ll create something called an avatar. And that’s getting very, very specific about. Who your customer is, what their life looks like, and actually turning that into a person that you can think about because it’s so easy when you’re doing an online business to be staring at a computer and to be thinking about all of those things that you have to do behind the scenes that you forget about the person that’s actually going to be purchasing and interacting with your

[00:13:00] product. So who is this person? What do they care about? What are their problems? What are all the other things that they’re doing and using in their lives? You know, are they an Apple person or are they a PC person? Because just knowing those sorts of things are going to give you, start to give you an even clearer idea of what that person is, what they care about. You know, if they’re an Apple person, then maybe they’re more. Interested in, uh, the simplicity of things and, and whereas a PC

[00:13:30] person perhaps likes to, um, be able to have more flexibility with what they can and can’t, um, mold a product to do, uh, what, what sorts of problems is your product solving, uh, is a great and very important question to be answering. And a great way that you can start to do that if you’re feeling a little bit lost, is looking at your competitors and reading through reviews of, uh, that people have left for your

[00:14:00] competitors. And that will start to give you a sense of what was it that was pushing these people to make purchases for that product? And you might even start to get some ideas about how you can improve that product to make yours even better than the competition, or if nothing else, that will give you some good angles that you can really emphasize as you begin to do your marketing, uh, and, and putting yourself out there online. Yeah,

[00:14:30] that’s, that’s true. And then of course, making the product better. Is this a list, of course. I mean you, you specialize in listings and then the content of it. Is that also something to look at as a differentiator? Like, Oh, this, these guys or girls don’t have a good listing? Pictures, copy. Is that a strong, I mean, the danger is they could improve their listing right later or, I mean, you should also just have the product good. Know your, know your market. I would say

[00:15:00] yes. Uh, I, I would say there’s a high likelihood that if, if your competitors, and there are not very many competitors, and none of them really have a great looking, uh, listing, you know, if there’s a lot of misspellings, if it’s very vague, if it’s just, you know, a few kind of basic details and leaving a lot of holes that seems to appear more often in cases when there’s not a lot of competition. And so they’ve been able to get by with not necessarily needing to

[00:15:30] invest in and making themselves look as good as they could and as, um as reliable as they should because there’s nobody really trying to steal a piece of the pie. And so that actually is a great opportunity. I wouldn’t, I wouldn’t rely on that as the only opportunity, but. But that would at least allow you to get a good head start on things and then perhaps they’ll realize, Oh, hey, this guy is like really biting into my profits. I’m going to need to

[00:16:00] step things up. But they, they may or may not even know that that’s something that they need to do. It’s not something that everybody values in the same way. But we see when we work with clients that have, um, that are already selling online and when we work on their listings. Oftentimes that yields an increase in conversion rates. And so it is something that even if you’re already selling, it’s a way to differentiate yourself and it’s a way to also build trust with your customers.

[00:16:30] It’s easy to say, okay, well, nobody really reads. They just look at pictures. They just look at reviews and you want to be thinking about number one, it’s not true that nobody reads, but to who is the person that’s actually going to be reading and who is the person that’s going to be reading everything. Most likely that person is going to be the most critical of grammatical errors or weird spelling. And so if they’re taking the time to go through your listing, you want to make sure

[00:17:00] that you’re impressing them or that you’re at least not doing anything to turn them off. Uh, you know, there’s been quite a few different big articles in the Washington post and other places about, uh, people selling problematic goods that aren’t safe. Um, and so. People are extra alerted to things that might cue them into a product not being what it says it is and things like those types of

[00:17:30] errors are a red flag for a lot of people. Okay. It makes, makes sense. So, so, you know, how do we know who our customer avatar is? You know, I think I kind of jumped back to what you were saying earlier about choosing how you could be different uh, from the current competitors and improve the product. What, what are some ways, especially, you know, an Amazon need? A lot of people ask me, they don’t know how to find, how do they know who they’re, it’s technically Amazon’s customers

[00:18:00] anyway, really. I mean, I dunno if you have some input how to, how they could know who they’re even selling to or who they’re catering to.

[00:18:11] Sure, what I would say is to start to narrow down and don’t be afraid of getting specific because I think everybody has this imagined world where they, everybody will want to buy their product. And the fact of the matter is, is that if you’re trying to sell to everybody, then you’re not going to be as successful

[00:18:30] as you could be if you’ve got very specific. And so. One of the things to do is just to kind of start honing in and, uh, you know, zooming in, if you will. Uh, so let’s, I’m trying to think of a, of an item that you could be selling. Let’s take a, um. I’m, I’m looking at some orchids that I have in the window. And so let’s take an, uh, an orchid planter holder. So an orchid planter is going to be different than

[00:19:00] other types of, uh, planters because it’s not going to have any holes in the bottom. Uh, the way that you care for an orchid is very different. Uh, and so thinking about that number one, the person purchasing that planter. Isn’t just anybody buying any type of planter, but it’s going to be somebody that likes orchids. Well, if you know anything about orchids, you know that orchids are not an easy plant to be taking care of.

[00:19:30] And so people that are very into orchids are a whole subset of green thumbs that really enjoy the challenge of raising these very exotic. Uh, plants that are also, you know, some plants, they bloom once a year. Well, some of these orchids, people might be spending years or even, you know, more than 10 years just to get one

[00:20:00] bloom on an orchid. And so that’s starting to be a very specific type of person. And if you don’t know about orchids or people that are into orchids, that’s okay, but maybe then you should go to an orchid shop and talk to somebody. Uh, I think that we try to do all of this work online, but sometimes we have great resources in person. So if you don’t know about people that are into orchids, go and talk to people that are, and then you can start to get an idea of what are the other

[00:20:30] things that they’re interested in their lives? What is really important to somebody that’s into orchids that maybe nobody knows about? Like maybe all orchid planters um, like the serious orchid growers are doing something to those planters to make it even better for their orchids. Or maybe none of them can find the right size for this really popular type of orchid. And so they’re needing to put all this extra stuff. Stuff to make it fit properly. So those are all details

[00:21:00] that you could get if you just started to get really curious about your customers, um, and, and taking advantage of the resources that you have right in front of you. Uh, so, so always following up with why and, and just having a long list of questions, but also being willing and open to letting the conversation lead you into different directions. Um, give some more prompts for specific questions to ask. Does that make

[00:21:30] sense? Yeah, I get it. I get it. Um, I’m thinking focus group is kind of popping into my head. I don’t know if that’s something you recommend or do. I mean, I guess a lot of people, we always think of w we don’t do it, but I guess it doesn’t have to be something like that formal. It could just be hanging out at a store, certain store that sells a product may, a specialty store and then an asking people shopping there. Exactly. So I think that, you know, a focus group is something that is, could be worthwhile for

[00:22:00] you depending on the product that you have. But you also have to understand that focus groups, um, can be quite costly and you would probably want to, uh especially if you’re just starting off or if you have an idea and it’s just sort of in its early stages, then you can get a lot of that data without having to invest so much money into it. So exactly going to a specialty shop, asking people questions

[00:22:30] is a great way to start to see is there a need here? And, who is my customer? And maybe you’ll also find out that Hey, in addition to your planter, everybody’s looking for something that they can use to protect their orchids from the harsh sunshine. Or to, um, water their orchids for them in a reliable way when they go on vacation because they don’t trust the neighborhood

[00:23:00] kid that house sits for them to properly maintain their orchids. So maybe you’re not only going to find out about that particular product idea, but you’ll find out about a few other product ideas while you’re at it. Okay. That’s, that’s some cool, cool stuff. You should, you talk, talk with the store or work with the store? the offline thing, or do it inside, or I would say if you’re going to be, uh, in a

[00:23:30] store asking their customers questions, then you should make yourself known and ask permission just because, especially since they can be such a great ally for you, uh, you don’t want to ruin a potentially valuable relationship. So and, and also the store that might give you better information than the people that are going in there because they know their customers and actually

[00:24:00] their customers might be very similar to the customers that you’re looking to sell to. So they’ve already done a lot of that research and they understand what people care about. And you might even be able to save yourself some time and energy by just talking directly with them. Okay. Interesting. Maybe we should, I don’t know if he has some  and we could talk about some specific examples. Maybe we don’t have to reveal products, but, um, is there, or we, we kind of talked, we’ve been talking a little bit about one case there.

[00:24:30] So let me, let me, well, maybe I’ll try my best to, to go through a story. You can give me your feedback. So I, I’m thinking about a product I want to sell or I already sell a the coffee, I sell coffee pots, coffee accessories, and I think of a new type of product that I could add that’s in this, in this brand. Um, I should think if that’s fitting my, my current avatar, right, like that price point, that type of product that they would

[00:25:00] also want to buy will be the first step. Yeah. So if you’re, let’s say that you’re not just selling coffee product, but you’re selling coffee products for people that they like to roast their own beans. So they’re coffee connoisseurs and they’re not afraid of price tag, and they, they are after the perfect cup of coffee, uh, regardless of how much they have to pay for it. So they’re really excited by new things that are going to keep them from

[00:25:30] scorching their beans and are going to, uh, achieve that perfect balance of acidity, uh, without, you know, I, I, I don’t know all the ins and outs of coffee, but you get where I’m going and so. You want to be thinking about, okay, well what else do they care about? What are other things? Maybe they love that perfect cup of coffee and they’ve perfected it at home. But they want to replicate that when they

[00:26:00] travel and they travel all the time for both work and pleasure. And so how, what are the types of products that you would be able to sell to them that they can use when they’re not at home so that they don’t have to get stuck drinking that disgusting hotel coffee or being grumpy for the first hour of the day until they can get their hands on it – semi decent a cup, and that’s assuming that they’re in a city where they have access to good coffee. Perhaps

[00:26:30] they also go to more remote locations where they don’t even have a choice of that, and so then they kind of have to deal with or, or they’re just in, in countries where instant coffee is the most, uh, common type of coffee, you’ll find it places. I mean, I’m, I’m sure that, you know, there, there are brands out there that are developing higher quality, instant coffee. But I would say that still most coffee kind of source are not instant coffee lovers.

[00:27:00] Although sometimes you can do what you gotta do if you’re on the road in China. Oh, yeah. I mean, I, I lived in Ecuador for six months and they really love Nescafe there. And Kevin sometimes be surprisingly difficult to find. Uh, actual brewed cup of coffee that isn’t just a hot, hot cup of water and a spoon in a container of Nescafe

[00:27:30] or something similar. All right. And then, you know, I of course everybody always thinks are keyword research, but you’re, this is before you were research and then you would do listing check listings. A lot of people do keyword research in their, their product development process before they have even placed an order with things. Because that’s also going to give you an indication of are people even searching for this product? Or perhaps they’re

[00:28:00] searching for some other things that if you could make a slight adjustment to your product design, may be able to capture all of those other queries as well. So keyword research can be great way to. C is, are people searching for this? Is this something that they’re wanting? Because if not, then you sort of have another challenge on your hands, and perhaps Amazon isn’t the best place for you to be starting off. Because if nobody’s searching for a product like yours,

[00:28:30] then how are, how are they going to find it? You know? So then you’re going to have to be doing a lot more of a. Of different types of marketing, depending upon what your product is. Uh, and so that’s, that’s something that you would just need to consider. I would say that Amazon is great for a ton of products, but it’s not great for every type of product. And particularly when it’s a very, uh, new

[00:29:00] and different product where there’s not a. Good solid, uh, base of, of queries already. It can be quite challenging and you need to get really creative with the types of keywords that you use, just to make sure you’re even getting in front of eyeballs. Hmm. Okay. And, and then of course, hopefully you found a good one with, within this cure research and the demand, and then you’re looking at.

[00:29:30] Listings on the marketplace, photos, of course, the copy. And then, um, you maybe, how much do you weigh, you know, I’m trying to weight these different factors here, but what’s the percent weight? You know, of course we’re talking to spit balling here, but maybe the listings look like they’re average or, you know, I’m trying to think, like, how are you at weights? The decision to approve this new product based on the current listings?

[00:30:00] That is a good question and I think that it really depends on so many factors that I would not the most qualified to answer. And I would just hate to give any kind of finite rule because I think every category is different. Every business is different. You know, the amount of capital that you have to do product development or the type of, you know, price point that you’re wanting to

[00:30:30] position yourself with. There’s just so many things that it’s. Yeah. I, I’m not the best person to give that advice, but I would also steer clear of. Um, of trying to find some magic formula where every time that’s, that will tell you that it’s going to be a runaway product. Cause I think that sometimes, uh, people are looking at those things and then they go down a

[00:31:00] rabbit hole that doesn’t always end well. Sure, sure. Fair enough. Thanks for, thanks for, you know, being straight up, but I guess, you know. I think it’s a tricky one of course, but I think if, if it looks like they haven’t done a good job with like their copy and their, their images, obviously that’s obviously a positive indicator, but I don’t think that’s the big, the biggest factor maybe in deciding, hopefully, hopefully first you think it fits your customer avatar here, your niche you’re already

[00:31:30] in and you’ve gotten maybe even got some offline feedback from these stores and . And, uh, you see the demand and the keywords. Um, maybe of course now is the, the copy right now is when you’re making the listing or if you checked off all these boxes. Yeah. So that, I guess that’s the point where you’ve placed your order, you’re, you know, you have a sample, so you’re able to start working on your photography, and then you want to be

[00:32:00] thinking about how are you actually going to communicate effectively with your customer. I think that a lot of times people feel more comfortable. What if they’re attracted to online business? They feel more comfortable in the analytics and numbers sides of things, and so it can be really easy to kind of fall into the trap of, okay, I know my keywords and I know my products. And so I just need to make sure that all of those details are on the page and I included all the keywords that

[00:32:30] I need to include, and they forget about the fact that there’s still a human that’s ultimately the one making the choice and clicking that button to purchase the product. And so keywords are so important to make sure that somebody gets to your page, but then. That’s where copy and imagery, um, and reviews event are what are going to turn that person that has gotten to your page and into a customer. And that’s a very important

[00:33:00] part of the whole process. And it’s. It’s the first and sometimes only impression that you’re having with these people. And so you want to make sure that you do everything you can to make them feel excited about your product, to feel reassured that this is the right product for them. And, uh, and then ultimately that this is the product that they’re going to purchase. Uh, because that’s what they had originally gone to Amazon to search for in the

[00:33:30] first place. Okay. Cool. This has been great, Emma, and I’m thinking getting towards the end here, how, how, what are some of the top ways people could optimize this listing? You know? And then where, where do people know when to give up on a listing, if that, you know? So, so we kind of went from the beginning. Mostly we talk about today’s choosing. If. From current competitors, current market, but how do you know

[00:34:00] when it’s like, okay, I just can’t optimize this. It’s just I’m dead. I’m done. Or maybe it’s not the right product. This is probably not going to be that this is not the right product. Is that what you are saying? Well, maybe the night the listing can’t be improved or it’s so competitive, or I maybe I, maybe I was wrong with my analysis and it’s not working out. Like maybe I can’t really optimize it, or maybe it’s just how do I know when to give up on maybe trying to

[00:34:30] optimize it or is there always a way to optimize it? I am a believer that optimizing is never over, uh, for a number of reasons. Uh, but that doesn’t mean that if your losing tons of money that you shouldn’t just call it, call it quits on that product. Uh, but again, that’s an assessment that you have to make. You know, some people, they do very big launches, uh, and they are okay with losing money for a while just to build that, uh,

[00:35:00] velocity. And to claim a top spot in the search results, but not everybody has the financial position to do something so aggressive. So it’s really, that’s going to have to be a personal calculation that you make, but when it comes to optimizing a listing, it’s not as though you’re doing something in a static world. So people’s queries are going to change over time. So the customers are going to

[00:35:30] become more sophisticated potentially with what they’re looking for or trends change. So an example I like to give is a few years ago, nobody had heard of the keto diet. And so if you were wanting to sell a product that was for the keto diet, you might be selling to a very, very small group of people. So that’s something that you would maybe want to be more broad with some of the types of terms that you’re using so that you’re not just limiting yourself to the very

[00:36:00] small Keto group that they haven’t fully developed. And perhaps they would also be less familiar with some different types of terminology. Well, you fast forward a few years now with keto diets and diet, uh, of this year. Pretty sure I don’t have hard facts to back that up, but it’s definitely, you know, when you see products for the keto diet being sold in Walmart, you know that it’s definitely a, uh, a big trend. And so now more and more

[00:36:30] people understand terms like MCT oil. And so those are different types of things that you can be, um, and should be paying attention to because you may either have an opportunity to get more specific and demonstrate that you really know your stuff and that you’re an authority. Uh, or there are new search terms that people are using because suddenly there are all these people that are more

[00:37:00] knowledgeable. And your, um, your customer base has, has grown, uh, or you know, even paying attention to your competitors and your own reviews and seeing if there are things that people are doing with your product that you hadn’t originally thought about that you want to make sure to address in the listing itself. So those are just a few examples of things that could potentially, um make you want to tweak your listing with

[00:37:30] time. So there’s not a hard and fast rule about how often you should be optimizing your listing. But I would say that if you’re just simply optimizing your listing and then leaving it for the eternity of selling that product, then you might be missing out on new opportunities that are presenting themselves. Awesome. This has been great. Thank you so much. Emma, it’s been great over the couple months to get to know you, uh, getting you to China. You

[00:38:00] know, we did talk about the visa letter stuff, but that went through and uh, you know, and, and your experience there and sharing and at the event and sharing on the show. So is, is obviously a pretty easy to remember. Is that the best place? Is there some other things or resources we would like to leave people with? Sure. So I can, uh, actually give you a link to a PDF that we just created that has a lot of those questions that you can

[00:38:30] start asking yourself, whether you’re in that early product development phase or you’re getting ready to optimize your listing to get a clear idea of who your customer is and what your, um, what problems your product is solving and all of that. So I can send that to you after. After we get, uh, wrap things up here. Um, it’s just a free PDF download. And also I’m, we’re always happy to take a look at somebody’s listing and

[00:39:00] say whether, uh, whether there’s, there are things that should be improved there or, you know, maybe actually photography is really a ware that person should be investing their time and resources to differentiate themselves, or maybe their listing looks great. And so there are know other things that they need to be doing. So we’re always happy to give some free feedback. So feel free to reach out at our website we’re also

[00:39:30] on Facebook Marketing by Emma. Um. And yeah, we would love to help in any way we can. Okay. It’s great. Think. Thank you again, Emma. It’s been, it’s been awesome. Thank you so much, Michael. I really enjoyed, uh, speaking with you and participating in the summit and getting to know you and the summit was great. Uh, and they just look forward to the next thing that we’ll be able to do together. Perfect. Yeah, I’m

[00:40:00] Looking forward to it too. Awesome. Thank you. Thank you Alpha Rock sponsors, supporter of me and Global from Asia. So it was a noted e-commerce gladiator book in the series here. They have, uh, supported the show and allowed us to continue rocking out these podcasts. I really appreciate Mark, Veras, David, Alex, Notre David, and many other amazing people there. If you’re interested to invest in

[00:40:30] Amazon without doing it yourself, and you may be want. They have some amazing partners that you can trust in. We’re doing amazing things at alpha rock, I will be in Manila with them for the first half of the year next year. Make an even more amazing things happen. Thank you, Emma. That was a fun little conversation. Hope listeners enjoyed that. I know sometimes people say, I don’t need more Amazon stuff. I want China and. Asia stuff we’re going to be working on getting some new style of content into the new

[00:41:00] year has been a lot of talk about Lazada Southeast Asia e-commerce. I’m excited to share about that and of course these on the ground stories of business owners and. Pioneers with arrows in their back. We’ll try to keep those stories come. I think those are some of my fears. I and, but thank you Emma. And she’s so supportive and really always been really fun to talk to. Building up to the cross border, something that last year. I know everybody’s asking, what about this year? Where is it going to be? When’s it going to be?

[00:41:30] Pretty stressful for me every time. I had a good call, good talk with Chris Davey from FBA for and his partner and amazing girlfriend, Cindy Juju, and you know, I know I want to, you know, they do amazing meetups. Two per trade show season and Canton fair. I was actually just in Amazon FBA meet up in Chiang Mai, Thailand, talking about it and preparing some people already for April,

[00:42:00] but for cross border summit, some is such a nightmare to organize honestly, and it makes a little bit of money but such a nightmare. I am talking to the Thailand government. Honestly, it gets some support doing it here. Um, but it won’t be until later in 2020 and I promise people, hopefully by the new year I’ll have a better plan and slept enough nights as well as into China. How bad. I can’t believe I’m going back into. North China freezing my butt off with my

[00:42:30] wife and two beautiful kids. All right. I’ve talked about, I said I would share some of my vermin stories and in China I think. Hmm. Even in Manhattan, I think I said in this interview. You know, there were rats in a, in New York city, all everywhere there was rats. It’s not like it’s a China thing, but it’s obviously a fun story and it will definitely be a memory. I’ll be chatting with her husband and her and future

 [00:43:00] encounters. And it’s, um, I think he’s got to realize you’re probably eating cockroaches and rat stuff when you’re eating at most. I’m sure we’ve all eaten it. You can be as kosher or as a vegan or whatever, but there’s going to be stuff that’s gonna fall into your food and you’re probably going to eat it in your prime and you’re never gonna know, maybe even ate cat or dog.

[00:43:30] And there’s another joke about that. And in college I went to Stevens Tech and Hoboken, New Jersey, and I, I’d order Chinese food a lot, thinking that’s normal Chinese food, but. I liked the chicken and broccoli and there weren’t many cats around. And then, um, I was a resident assistant in RA in college for a few years. And my other friend, other RAs cause the Chinese restaurant takes all the cats and cooks them all. I’m like, yeah, I mean, cat .

[00:44:00] Um, I don’t know. This is the blah, blah, blah session. So if you want to just skip this, but I’m going to ramble a little bit. Another part of that’s funny. I’ve got some dog loving friends and they asked me to help them with some campaigns in China to coach to the dog eating festivals. There’s some dog eating festivals in China, I think still, at least a few years ago. And I remember I used to have Facebook on my phone and I got a messenger pop up, and

[00:44:30] I won’t say her name, but let’s just say Lilly. And she say, Hey, Mike, I really don’t like the Chinese people eat dogs. And I want to go to China to, um, protest and I want to gather People and I want to go and assemble in front of this dog eating festival in China and stop them.  can you help me? And I’m like, Lily, I don’t like it that, uh, people eat dogs either, but

[00:45:00] I live in China and it kinda wanna stay here. And unfortunately, I cannot help you to assemble people in China to protest a dog eating festival and you’re sorry, you can continue to try that, but a, count me out, sorry. But there’s always, there’s been no multiple times that I’ve seen rats falling out of those drop ceilings. So like Emma Sanders, these drops, the only thing that, they’re all everywhere in the world, but

[00:45:30] especially in a kitchen, right. Because the kitchen, they have those. Deem and the hot air coming up from the stove. And there’s events usually, but it still kind of comes up and it gets hot and it gets damp. And those, those, those drop ceilings get wet. And I don’t know, China has kind of gotten more clean than it used to be as it’s developed so rapidly, whether you like it or not. And how was eating some fried beef? Fried noodles. Those are awesome. Actually. Some I think from South

[00:46:00] China and I was in Shenzhen and. It was literally in the daytime. It wasn’t even night like her. It was like daytime cause usually I think rats are out at night, but it was like noon or one o’clock and then there was a crash and he just looked and he just saw like one or two rats just fall, the drop ceiling like broke, you know, split it because it’s wet and heavy and rats just fell right into the middle of the kitchen because the kitchen door was open and I’m sitting near the kitchen and you just see these rats just fall. And the cooks are like just

[00:46:30] trying to whack it and a plan. I’m going to, I’m going to balance this with the U S like I was in a fraternity in college too. Um, I didn’t live there cause I was an RA, so I got free room and board college, which is pretty helpful. And. I would go there a lot, and there was the time, I’m forgetting the name, with the duty of that person, they have to kind of keep the kitchen clean and make sure the foods there for the cook. We had a cook at the fraternity, so there was a rat in the

[00:47:00] basement. The basement was where the kitchen was, which I don’t recommend having a basement where your kitchen is, but that’s where the kitchen was and there was a rat, and this dude, Dean, I won’t say his last name, but Dean is his real name, fraternity brother. And he was the guy in charge of the kitchen. He literally stayed there for like a day, I think even overnight with like a baseball bat, just try and wait for the rat to come out and whack it. And I think he finally got it. But yeah, I mean there are rats, you know, there are rats a in life. I think, you know,

[00:47:30] my, my great grandfather and. Grandfather came into the U S through Ellis Island, and I think that’s where rats came from, was all those freaking boats crossing the Atlantic ocean from Europe to the U S if I remember right or, where they started growing so much in those dirty ships. You know? That’s really crazy. I guess I’m the new, and like my grandfather coming into Ellis Island, I’m coming into Asia. It’s not as open as it used to be

 [00:48:00] for those immigrants, but there’s still opportunity here, and I’m sure there was so many rats he must’ve seen on that boat on Ellis going to Ellis Island, New York from Italy. Can’t imagine how dirty that must have been. So we’ve got to keep it all in perspective. I think it’s true. Like some people say, Oh, China’s so polluted, China’s so dirty. I’m sure. A hundred years ago. Man, isn’t that crazy? Just like only like a hundred years ago, right? Alice Island was happening and there was probably

[00:48:30] Italians and other Europeans saying, Oh, you’re, you’re going to America. You’re going to go on that dirty ship with rats and you’re going to go into this dirty city. Like I think New York city, you know, Manhattan was like a slum. I, if I remember, I’ve watched videos and stuff and it was dirty, man. I’m sure there was more than rats. Of course, there were whorehouse. This, and there was, you know, there was gambling and there was mafia, you know, I’m sure there was dangerous and dirty and I’m sure my dad, his dad and my grandfather

[00:49:00] ate rat, not knowing in rats, fallen on a ceiling. So, you know, we can all pick on China if we want or these developing countries. But we’re, we’re here to kind of, honestly, I think it’s fun, man. I dunno. I guess that’s why I chose to stay out here. Um, and to fill my life here, but Emma seemed okay about it, but you know, she’s like, you know, a typical girl, no, no offense to women, but you know, I guess his third year

[00:49:30] of her, her Husband was there and he’s just like, I’m going eat, I’m a hungry and she’s all freaking out. But I think we got to just prepare for that when we go to a new developing. Growing market and millions and billions of people, you know, like food safety and cleanliness, and it’s just hard to keep up with that. But all right, the grab is maybe getting close to drop me off with my wife and kids. So I do this sometimes on Thursdays going between Chiang Mai, my FBA

[00:50:00] meetup to my house. Near prom auto mall, got some more listeners to subscribe. At least hopefully they’ll subscribe. But yeah, I think the best way to grow this show, if there’s, you know, there’s some hardcore listeners I think, but I don’t think we’re up in the listings re. Reviews always help. You know, I was just so tired of begging for reviews. You know, he begging for reviews on your books. You’re ranking for reviews and your podcasts. You’re begging for reviews on different business things, events,

[00:50:30] whatever. Review would be helpful. I don’t, haven’t really begged for reviews for years, but I spent a while, I think since we’ve gotten a review, I don’t even know if I check anymore, but thank you so much for choosing to download and listen all the way till the end of this about 10 minutes or so, blah, blah, blah session. Thanks everybody. And I can’t wait for the new year. I’m really, uh, scared and excited at the same time, going up to Shenyang kids, going to Chinese school for half a year and then back to Chiang

[00:51:00] Mai and a summer. You get more involved running an international business. Please visit our website. At that’s triple also, be sure to subscribe to our iTunes feed. Thanks for tuning in.

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