Stuck In China: Business Deal Gone Bad and Exit Bans with John Graham Harper

Michael MicheliniBusiness, Culture, Podcast2 Comments

Today’s show is a scary one, and a warning / lesson for all of us doing international business – and yes – China is a challenging market, so especially in China – we can get into unexpected binds and get stuck somewhere- this time it is stuck in China. It is also a call for donations if you are moved. And not a big request for donations – I’ll put it out there – I threw 20 bucks into the “hat” – so don’t feel pressured to make a huge investment – John is sincere person and a dollar goes a long way.

Also I’m really excited to say we have gotten great feedback from listeners who are excited that the show is back. Many have been reaching out after hearing the come back show and Rico’s interview last week. I feel the love, and maybe it is true – you don’t appreciate something until you lost it.

Very exciting news – our friends and supporters at AureliaPay – now rebranded as GoRemit.Hk – are onboard to sponsor the show again. Thank you guys for that – for listeners who don’t know about these guys – I’m a user myself and many others in the community – it is a cross border payments company for Hong Kong based companies. I use them to send money to my team and suppliers in Mainland China, Philippines, and Thailand. They support more places as well, and you fund your bank by transferring from your HK bank to your account, and then can make a lot of small payments to staff in the Philippines, or to China, etc. They make money on the exchange rate, but it is worth it in the wire fees or the need to open local bank accounts in all those countries. We have a GFA review about them as well with a video and more we will link up in the show notes, we will have them sponsoring the podcast and thank you Simon and the team for your support.

Alright, now, let’s get into the interview this week!

Topics Covered in this Episode

  • John’s Story coming to China

    How John came to China, moved up from a personal trainer, to gym owner, to White Collar Fight Night

  • Who the gym business is best suited for

    For a love and passion for fitness

  • The buyout deal went down

    How John found the buyer, PT debt (personal training debt) and the transactions

  • Loan, Salary Payments to Pay The Debt

    More discussion on the deal format, and collateral

  • Fast Forward To Later 2018

    John tries to leave China, and customs security approaches him w/ a gopro to their vest to a holding area

  • Police Reading a Statement, mentioning Qianhai Court

    John’s recollection of what the statement said (in Chinese) and Qianhai business court keyword.

  • How easy it is to sue in China

    John lets us know how easy it is for someone to sue you in China and what they need

  • False Statements in court

    John wasn’t aware of the court case, but from the court proceedings the buyer of the business made false statements – but he wasn’t there to defend himself

  • Reminder - always keep your address up to date with Chinese police

    Reason why you want to make sure you register your address with the police

  • Verdict Set For no Show

    How John lost, because he wasn’t there and how much he has to pay now

  • Being added to a Blacklist in China (Exit Ban)

    This was flagged at customs / immigration and his passport is on a blacklist

  • Options He Has

    Re-open case and Fight it? Negotiate to a lower amount. His case and the evidence he has. Cost to appeal, he needs 8 to 10 thousand USD to appeal, plus time, and the amount he has to pay is 35 to 37 thousand USD.

  • Starting his own podcast

    Stuck in China (link in show notes). Wants to start a fund Expat Defense Fund, as there is really no help out there

  • Supporting this cause

    How you can help get John un-stuck from China (Mike has chipped in already). Every bit counts.

People / Companies / Resources Mentioned in this Episode

√ Show’s sponsor: GoRemit HK
√ John’s Go Fund Me campaign
John’s video letter on youtube
Mike’s Blog post about being Stuck in China
√ Winston (SerpentZA) talking about this on ADV China

Show Sponsor:

Episode Length 53:59

That is a wrap – we are really rocking and rolling better than ever here at Global from Asia. and it is my birthday today to top it off. The Global From Asia bootcamp is building up to be bigger and better than ever.

Download Options


gfa247.mp3 stuck in china
[00:00:00] Episode 247 of global from Asia stuck in China. Let’s do this. Welcome to the global from Asia podcast where the daunting process of running an international business is broken down into straight-up actionable advice and now your host Michael Michelini. today shows a little bit of a scary one, but.
[00:00:29] For any of us doing international business and yes including China is especially challenging or unique Market. I think anybody would agree with that Chinese or Foreigner so we can always get ourselves into unexpected binds and getting stuck somewhere is pretty scary whether it’s stuck in your room as a kid, sometimes I stick my kids in my in their room or getting stuck somewhere like in a country like China.
[00:00:55] So today we’re going to be asking for donations if you don’t mind I chipped in, you know, just 20 [00:01:00] bucks myself in the Hat no big pressure, but maybe after you hear this it’s a maybe motivate you hop on over there. We don’t get any commission off of here GFA go information, but John’s is sincere person and you know, we’ll put the hat out for him here the G fa SHO.
[00:01:18] Also before we get into the interview, I’m just excited to say they’ve gotten amazing feedback last couple of weeks since we’ve came back online and some members and G of a like reached out to us wonder what happened and some other people in there. Like I said, I know it’s been abrupt but it was a special project for a few months deep into Amazon and an incubator and will catch people up on says more ready to share about.
[00:01:44] But yeah, of course I couldn’t stay away from this microphone. It’s getting a little Dusty so we got back and it’s been really really amazing. So thank you so much for for listening people like Rico show last week. And people are excited about this boot camp were putting together in July here in [00:02:00] Thailand and some ID and eight and October.
[00:02:02] Yeah, he’s being April October in Guangzhou and got great people helping us out with all that. Also some more good news by coming back are really a pay our friend Simon. Well now they’ve rebranded as go remit HK. You can see it in the show notes. They’ve come back as a sponsored or third year now sponsoring Global from Asia.
[00:02:22] Thank you to them and you guys should also give them a little bit of a thanks. I’ll get the standard advertisement clip in the show. But before I did that today, just wanted to thank them. You know in a custom way in my intro they are for those that don’t know their a cross-border Payment Solutions.
[00:02:43] Company specifically helping people with Hong Kong companies that if they’re not a bank though, so you have to have a banking solution. But what they can do is help you get money from Hong Kong to Mainland China to Thailand to [00:03:00] Philippines to many other countries, but I’ve been a user for many years.
[00:03:04] I honestly used to use these underground payment people use some of you might know those people it’s a little gray these. Go remit that HK is legitimate. They have a money service operator MSO license in Hong Kong to be able to hold money on your behalf and send it to other. Countries and receivers on your behalf.
[00:03:26] And yeah, of course, they make money on the exchange rate and a fee in the middle, but their rate has actually been lowered and did so very attractive and I guess your other alternative is you could have bank accounts in the Philippines and Thailand and Mainland China and everywhere around the world, but I see I really honestly use them just paid some of our team members helping with this show bye-bye them to their Philippines bank accounts, so.
[00:03:51] You know, you could also try to open your own banking become your own card quote-unquote cross-border payment where you have money everywhere, or you wire money from one Country Bank to [00:04:00] another country bank, but then the world’s getting very complicated so I don’t want to deal with that anymore. We also have them on a global formation review where you can read about it.
[00:04:09] We have a video there we put with screencast. I think I did that and we had our co-hosts some we have some amazing people besides me hosting some of the content on the show. So you can check that out in the show notes at Global four episode 247 or just go right over to our website. Go remit Geo Re Mi t– H– k.
[00:04:30] This Rebrand we rebranded as little bit easier for me to spell than a really a pay so it’s go remit dot h k and yeah, I mean just let them know where you came from if you can and there’s some kyc but then once you get going you can make your payment’s. Oh thanks Simon and team there and you guys been growing and we’ve been growing and we really appreciate this.
[00:04:53] Alright. So now for this week’s show we have John Graham Harper. Some people may [00:05:00] know my know. There’s a lot of listeners in the Shenzhen or South China area. That know him. He’s got the white collar fight night. He’s done boxing gyms. As you know friend of mine over the years. He’s in the community’s help to help us out with some stuff here at GFA.
[00:05:13] So he has yes for some help. He’s trying to do some media start his own podcast. But basically he stuck in China. There’s an exit ban on him. He’s on a blacklist. It’s pretty crazy. He was also on Winston or serpens. Ah, so he’s always been our show. He’s also on their YouTube channel, and that did really well.
[00:05:32] Hundreds of thousands of views and we’ll link that up. Also if you want to watch a TV China’s YouTube version and Winston’s talking about this story to this one is an interview. So I got John on this show and we talked about the story we talked about what happened. And how he’s stuck and how he needs your help and he’s trying to fight this case a little bit of an update.
[00:05:54] Is he even had lawyers willing to do it for free? He’s been getting a lot of coverage but [00:06:00] seems like the lawyers are saying basically might not be able to win fight this but they can negotiate a lower amount. So that’s what the campaign is about is trying to. Negotiates this it’s a pretty crazy situation and honestly in a show, I got a little bit scared, you know, maybe I’ll get stuck there if I go, but I’ll be I’ll be planning to come back to China soon anyway.
[00:06:20] Enough of this intro stuff. Let’s get into interview after the show. I’ll talk about some other things. There’s today’s a special day for me personally when the show is going online April 2nd 2019 as well some updates on the boot camp and other things we’ll talk about that as been a little bit of a longer intro again.
[00:06:37] Thanks go remit that HK cross-border payments solution for sponsoring this show. And and everything you for listening, let’s tune in. Are you looking at Brand registry and other benefits of being an actual brand this is the future of e-commerce and business in general. So make sure you get your trademark set up correctly.
[00:06:55] Our partners at trademarks to 47.9 or [00:07:00] 24/ can help you get set up online fast easy and the right way get the info you need as well as the services at swidden s24. walking our way to a global firm Asia podcast. This one actually have a meeting to get John in this show for a while.
[00:07:20] And now we have a really good good reason to John Graham from Shin-chan Australian business owner entrepreneur. How is it going John? Good. It’s a I wish it would be under better circumstances right? I know but still this is good. It’s good to get on the podcast for sure. Yeah, and we’ll talk about it to where you’re getting some more your own content out there and educating and connecting and maybe that’s hopefully going to be a positive outcome from your ear current.
[00:07:51] I don’t know what to say nightmare. Yeah situation. So yeah, so a little bit of background you need these [00:08:00] things in life. You need a little bit of a crush. It’s true things you need things to be. Yeah, I mean, I guess that’s there’s a saying whatever doesn’t you know, whatever doesn’t kill you only makes you stronger.
[00:08:13] So you’ll you’ll definitely come out stronger from this. So before we get into the the tragedy of the the nightmare list. Start a little bit on the upper note here. You’re pretty well-known in the in the expat Community been very active mostly within you know, the fitness space I’ve seen, you know over the years, you know, you’ve been in articles and you know, impress and China and around the world about, you know, kind of being a bridge for fitness and health and you have we’ve had a series of gyms and you’ve your main thing now is the white collar fight night, which I’ve been to and I could probably link to some other videos.
[00:08:50] I’ve done some Vlogs and content there too. And it’s so says that and wind it may be a little bit of a little bit more background feeling little bit more [00:09:00] for me about about someone after listeners. Yeah, just like you said, um, yeah, you did come to one of those those the white color event came to the an event.
[00:09:10] I believe it was in 2017. It was one that I think was the second event. We did. Yeah, you deaf. I would love to see that video again that you did. That was a fun one. Yeah me guess. I it’s in I would say. Okay, let’s say the first came to China about 18 years ago. I’ve always been sort of involved in Fitness passion Fitness is my number one passion and I started out as a personal trainer here in Shenzhen and the city was growing it was starting there was a good expat community.
[00:09:45] And there was no there was no wasn’t really a fitness seen and there certainly wasn’t any English-speaking personal trainer. So I actually did quite became quite well known in fast, because I had a nice right? I wasn’t nobody else was doing this. So I’m [00:10:00] I used that influence that community and I raise some money to open up my first gym, which some of you are some of the people on your podcast they’ve been involved in that a lot of people know about that.
[00:10:14] And then it went on I opened up a series of other gyms all good learning experiences. Not not not exactly. I mean if I were talking about the gyms in a in a way in which they were successful, you would probably know about it you but some yeah, none of them. I stuck with for many different reasons doing business in China does have its challenges.
[00:10:38] Yeah, but yeah now it’s now it’s down to the fight nights and that I’m very happy with. I mean, that’s just that’s just such a great business to do so fun. So exciting making people hit each other and yeah and trying to scale that it actually is a very fun fun thing to do. Yeah. I know I will link to your campaign video [00:11:00] which was pretty you know, Connected with me pretty well, but I think a lot of you know listeners are normally business owners and you know, it’s obvious learn English, but they’re, you know, even Chinese listeners and you know a business is you know, Just like going into the fight into into the arena.
[00:11:16] I always talk about that with I have some serious in the past about e-commerce Gladiator and others, you know, and especially with the gym, you know, there’s High fixed costs, which is very a lot of pressure. I mean even even I mostly have been a running online but you know, even payroll and staff, you know, you got these fixed monthly cost of team members or or anything for business owners, you know, I think I think.
[00:11:41] I think what I’ve also been trying to do it, you know, I is be more variable based right? So your your revenues go higher maybe your Costco higher, but at least if your revenues happened go down Four Seasons or other reasons, right? You can morphe flexible. Whereas like gyms or or [00:12:00] Airline, you know, I always think of Airlines.
[00:12:01] I don’t know if you know not I worked on. Wall Street for a while in junk bonds are distressed debt and just a quick one, but the airlines are always going bankrupt because they had high costs of are you know, the just had to have the planes they had to have the rent costs, you know, so those kind of businesses are really hard so I know I know how I can only imagine how hard Jim’s could be and and like in your campaign video.
[00:12:30] The costs of Shenzhen I mean obviously I’ve even you know for those similar reasons, I’ve had to spend less time. I moved to Thailand probably one of them was to the rising cost of shin. Jin is a great City. We love it, but it’s getting really expensive right would you say that’s right. Yeah, it’s gettin It’s Gettin outrageously expensive.
[00:12:51] Yeah, Jim’s I wouldn’t I wouldn’t really recommend opening up a gym business to anyone. I mean, it’s I kind of see it as two ways. If you open up a [00:13:00] gym business it’s service, right? You’re it’s based on service. It’s a service-based business. So and it’s to do with your. It’s like a passion business.
[00:13:08] So if you love to workout, you can spend hours in the day of the day in the gym and just train clients train yourself and just keep doing this day after day after day and you are happy then wonderful. That’s your that’s your business. But if if you want to grow it, if you actually want to to make it bigger if you want to be able to take, you know, a couple of months off and go on holiday and have it still running.
[00:13:32] It’s not the best business to choose be your. You know you have to do the other way to do it is to sort of design some sort of scalable concept pitch it to a large fund and have many locations built so that you can you know, perhaps even go IPO or something. There’s just which is a lot of what the big chains that’s their focus.
[00:13:51] That’s what they’re trying to do. So you kind of can’t do any any Middle Ground there because it is a very high cost Jim your your your your. [00:14:00] You know, your location is successful you may have low rent but the rent will rise because of you know, the just the way China expands, right? So if you if you’re in a good location, you have cheap rent and then suddenly that location starts developing what’s gonna happen you’re here is gonna rise exactly and you’re gonna be like, okay.
[00:14:19] Do I raise my monthly membership for the gym. Do I raise my personal training fees? Like it’s and customers don’t like that right? It’s not. Adele just simply start commuting to the other gym. That’s in a location where their rent is cheap, right? So it’s kind of yeah, it’s not it’s a tough business.
[00:14:37] It’s a very tough business and I’ve learned a lot of lessons from it. I’m very happy about that. I see that I did take a lot of a lot of lessons from. All these these Ventures that have had tried to pursue here in spanish. Sure. So that’s perfect. Yeah, I mean another similar. I’ve not sure if you’re aware.
[00:14:56] I was a shareholder partner of a what the first [00:15:00] co-working space and shinjin is called Ash engine team and 2011 and okay, you know, I was passionate about you know, I’m still passion about startups and Tech and I was doing meetups and then I got I was kind of looking to do it too, but I got invited by a couple other.
[00:15:16] As I had a space but similar similar story you have to always be pushing members people sign up. You’re like, I just want to go to the event. I just want to stop by. I don’t know if I really want to commit to a monthly, you know membership and then we had our rent was like, you know. Pretty high I mean so yeah, I mean, I move more into events like you with startup weekends at a time and now it’s like, you know the e-commerce space with the glow from Asia.
[00:15:38] So yeah, I totally agree with you on your your your your your own kind of strategies and but you know, I guess the problem was you almost got out out of this jump is this but this is this topic of today’s story is it kind of maybe was like them off The Godfather Goodfellas you try to get out but.
[00:15:58] It came [00:16:00] back to haunt you or put I don’t know like, you know, I could say this word you wanted to do you wanna say you know, where you are you coming back? Yeah, so long story short, of course this this this whole story. This is a very long story, but I’m just the condensed version. So this gym business the cost became too high.
[00:16:22] We had three Partners one left and when that partner left, we sort of realize that maybe it’s time for us to move on from this business because we just couldn’t manage these costs. So. We wanted to you know, at first our dream was to sell the business where you know, we’re we have this inflated idea the idea of how valuable it is, like surely somebody would buy it.
[00:16:43] I mean we bought it why wouldn’t somebody else buy it, but actually the design of a gym business is it’s very it’s not sellable you you wouldn’t sell out there’s no brand value because you’re just confined to one location. So really what you want in a gym business if it’s just [00:17:00] one. You want somebody to basically take the responsibility of the gym because there’s PT debt people are owed personal training sessions.
[00:17:08] They bought let’s say it’s 50 session package. So that money is in the business, but they are owed session. So the business needs to pay the trainer to carry out their session. So that’s that’s PT that so successful Jim’s you know, they may have a running PT dead of you know, like let’s say downtown the middle of Shenzhen.
[00:17:26] I would say in the range of maybe 3 million remedy is just always in flux. It’s always fluctuating this amount. It never goes away because not everyone consumes their 50 sessions all in one day all at the same time. So it’s that’s sort of the design of a gym business and which means you can’t really sell it.
[00:17:44] Right. So you’re basically saying okay who can take responsibility for this PT debt if there is value there the members will read by but you need someone to take that responsibility. So the I found a quote unquote friend someone I met up in [00:18:00] Shanghai when I was boxing. He expressed an interest in taking the business and taking that you know, because he want to own his own right it’s you know these that there’s certain people with this gym rats feeling like I want to go to gym.
[00:18:13] It’s what I’ve always wanted, you know, and so those were those are the kind of people when you aren’t looking to transition out you want them to take it over because it’s you know, it’s nothing no surprises for them. And then also that you know, they’re going to continue it on as well. So but actually what the situation was is that he the the way we wanted to transfer the business out was through alone.
[00:18:37] We owe two months rent and we go to salaries you said give us this money so that we can pay the pay the debt to that we owe to our rent to our salaries and then the collateral is the gym. So the treadmills the machines the dumbbells the flooring the computers the desks the chairs everything that you see in a gym all of this.
[00:18:57] When Compass the collateral of that [00:19:00] loan, so then we said we said so so this was the agreement carried out and then about of they have fast forward. Till August last year. I tried to leave the country. So I’m sending an airport looking to take a flight out. I get my boarding pass I go through I’m going through immigration and then suddenly the guy, you know, I can see like there’s a beeping noise on his computer looks at me and you know and everyone in China, they know this feeling that they’re like, okay, what is it this time?
[00:19:32] You know, like what could it possibly be? And he’s looking at me and then two guards come and they have like their the cat a camera. It’s like a GoPro but is strapped to their body. So they’re not holding. It’s just sort of like placed on their body and they take me to this holding area and they’re like don’t talk empty all your pockets.
[00:19:51] Do not speak, you know. So I’m like, okay, and I’m just thinking like what could this be? What and I’m thinking maybe it’s you know something to do with you know some business in and I’m [00:20:00] trying to go through all the businesses. I’m like what business what business were and then finally he the guy brings me out and he reads a statement and he’s reading the statement in Chinese and then the word 10 high which is that new economic area in Shenzhen.
[00:20:16] You know that are is like a new so yeah free trade area. He said is that word Chennai and the moment. He said that word. I knew that it was about a court case because Jen hi is where the court is located. That’s where the the that’s where because I’ve heard many people say oh, yeah Chennai Chennai Chennai and they were there talking about.
[00:20:37] Oh, I have to go to Chennai Chennai Court Chennai court. It’s like we’re all the business Court proceedings. And I and the moment you said it. I don’t know what it was but just triggered in my head and I was like, there’s something it’s a court case and then what I found out later is this guy filed a court case against me filed a case against me, which actually is very cheap to do if you have your [00:21:00] because in the process.
[00:21:00] So the loan my ID my passport ID he had this so if you have someone’s ID and China, you can sue them your bits. That is the pretty much the only thing you need to you need then he made if he made a false statement in the. In court and what he said was is that the collateral the gym Equity the treadmills machines the desk the computers all of this.
[00:21:25] This wasn’t mine to use in this loan transaction. That was the statement he made and this and the the court apparently did try to call me. So this is a lesson out for all of you guys doing business in China and you see those unknown numbers that are calling you. Maybe you want to pick up that phone here and there because that could be the court informing you you’ve been sued you need to come to court and figure this out.
[00:21:53] So I’m like the court like the first thing I did when I did get a lawyer’s I asked him I said how [00:22:00] has this case been given the the correct service? It’s actually the term is. This and he looked into that first and he said yes, so apparently they did try to call me. You just didn’t answer the unknown number and I think they did send me like the the court notification but to my old dress so I did move.
[00:22:20] Again, who checks their mailbox and now so maybe we’ll do this in China exactly. Yeah, but maybe it is something you want to start doing just yeah as a takeaway, right? So what had happened was the case had been tried to hearing and the verdict had been set. So I have been declared guilty. I did not show up to the case that they check they said.
[00:22:48] Okay, we tried to contact John. He did not he didn’t pick up his phone. He didn’t respond the cats will carry out the went on my I got given the verdict that I was guilty [00:23:00] and then I was put on a black. So the the guy that sued me he appealed to the court to actually petition immigration to have my name put on a black list.
[00:23:12] Now. A lot of people are asking me they’re saying is your Pat. Do you have your passport? Yes. I have my passport. But my name John Graham Harper is on The Blacklist. So this name I can’t open another company with this sort. So if I go. Chennai is also where you know, it’s the where people open companies now, if I were to go to Chennai nowhere to open a Company the company would freeze basically would be would say we can’t continue the company at because this name is attached to a case.
[00:23:40] You need to fix the case before you open up a company, so. There’s a lot there’s a lot that happened. I mean I’ve even heard of people on The Blacklist in China like I mean famous famous celebrities, you have government officials yet Bankers. I mean, even that was the name bing bing bong bing bing or yeah, [00:24:00] I’ve heard that name.
[00:24:02] Yeah, she was she was she was barred from leaving as well because of tax evasion. So it’s something very common. Right? My my situation was is that I’m in a case. And the guy actually met he requested. I want him to put on The Black List. I want I don’t want him to leave China but this situation.
[00:24:21] What now is the government is borrowing certain people that have avoid attacks or may be involved in some sort of fraud Scandal or anything like that. So it’s something that’s happening a lot. If you Google Barden far like banned from the or exit bands trying to exit bands. You’ll see a lot of information out there now.
[00:24:38] So so what are my options right now? Okay, so I’m trying to fight this case. So what I need to do is I need to get the case reopened. So to get the case reopened it takes quite a considerable amount of money and considerable amount of time. Hi, both of which I don’t really have so that’s why I’m running [00:25:00] this campaign.
[00:25:00] If if I can get them case opened my suspension of my name is is lifted. So I’m no longer on The Blacklist and then I’m in an open case. It’s you know, it’s about my lawyer versus your lawyer. What evidence do you have? And the evidence that I have? Of course I feel according to my lawyer is. I’m okay that’s safe.
[00:25:20] So it behooves me to try to have this case reopened get myself off The Blacklist and then you know, you know have the an actually have a cape a court case right fight this fight this battle. Yeah, so that’s the plan. That’s the initial plan. The the sad thing is. I’ve actually been told by not just not just expats but Chinese businessmen that I know I’ve been even told by by lawyers that even if I appeal to the prosecution Department to reopen the case and I file a separate case against him.
[00:25:56] To to to encourage the [00:26:00] prosecution Department to open the case these two things actually won’t work. I’ve been told that this won’t work that you’ll still have to pay but but who knows who like then there are days where I’m thinking what am I doing? And then there’s other days run thinking no, this isn’t right.
[00:26:16] This is you know, this is this isn’t like I’m sort of trying to think on the bright side. Maybe this is it is something that could happen. Maybe if I get enough media exposure, you know, the case can be opened and this can be something where you know, because it’s not it’s just against this one guy.
[00:26:32] He knew the legal system. He had my ID and it’s very common. I mean that it’s a scam that happens in China all the time. They use the. Because honestly if you if the way the court works here is everything is settled outside the court. So I sue someone I have the I have the I have the leverage right?
[00:26:52] So your options are just to settle outside Court The Cook the case won’t just disappear. You will have to either settle [00:27:00] outside or you’ll have to fight the case. And I believe in civil cases only 51% of evidence is needed to make a conviction right? It’s not it’s a very it’s a different system. The court isn’t used as a way to get Justice or get what get what’s right?
[00:27:16] It’s used as a sort of a bargaining tool. In a much larger scam you could say to be able to squeeze some money out of people and people run these things in China. They do multiple multiple times. They’ll have like multiple cases like this going all the same time just to get bits of money from you know from each person.
[00:27:37] But yeah be explained all this in many articles incentives to news island as they come out. I’ll post them out. You can see further details of how I see court system using and how people doing business in here expats and you in Chinese they can watch out for certain things and be careful. Certain things that come up so they don’t get into a situation like this.
[00:27:59] Right [00:28:00] exactly. Like I think we prepare for the show and talking, you know, it’s obviously a little bit. You know, I don’t want to be I’ve said it actually some wonderful latest shows. I’ve had have been a little bit sometimes. I don’t see an entire, you know, you just got to be careful in China and I think it’s not just foreigners.
[00:28:16] It’s Chinese in China. I mean I talk to my wife about this Wendy and she’s Chinese and she yeah, she’s like this is kind of normal. I mean her family even even her. Father I don’t know somebody Neff somehow related distant relative of her father scammed scam his forefather in a business deal for a restaurants in her hometown and didn’t pay back or something horrible.
[00:28:40] And I just I just think you know, I just want to at least note that it’s not, you know, we’re not like, you know, this happens. I think Chinese listeners or Chinese people would you know know that this stuff happens within each other and a lot of times especially with we do a lot of Amazon talks here and people talk about the.
[00:28:56] Chinese sellers on Amazon and what they do to each [00:29:00] other, you know that it’s not just like a China versus a foreigner thing, of course, but then you did say I don’t know if you said it today show but you know, obviously they these scammers know that foreigners are even easier because we don’t even know these these things right?
[00:29:13] So it’s something we got to be that’s right even more careful about because we don’t even know what could happen. So it’s right. Absolutely. Absolutely. I mean Chinese Chinese they go through similar situations. If not worse. Like you’ve heard stories. I’ve heard stories. This is kind of what what where every of my message everything that I’m saying.
[00:29:36] I’m shining a light on it for so expats can see they can so, you know that they can understand this but this is this happens all the time in China of two Chinese. I mean, I know like my girlfriend’s my girlfriend’s mother. Her sister was involved in a pretty heavy a scam that drained all of the families, you know, the savings and everything so very similar to what you just mentioned.
[00:29:58] Yeah, some guys in the town. [00:30:00] That’s a great idea. Give me all your money. And then he just leaves right exactly all the time. It’s actually a mile. My wife had a horrible. Yeah, like she remembers when she was younger the family had not much money because this scam and it was even within a family and also it’s horrible.
[00:30:15] It’s horrible. So I just at least want to make sure people know that this does happen. It’s like you said even as kind of common but it’s not just against Forest course, it seems like if they’re scammer and E. They could of course Target us he’s more easily so. So of course hopefully people is in listening.
[00:30:33] I had similar issue where I had people I had my phone ringing off the hook. Once it was seriously like not stopped ringing and was like a and I picked it up and and much my Chinese isn’t so perfect but I can understand that. He was just trying to say something about registering. I didn’t register with the police then they didn’t they’re really getting more strict last few years.
[00:30:55] I would say, I don’t know if you agree. I just in general like the whole. [00:31:00] Policies seem to be is more strict. So there’s been situations like that and the other crazy stories. From that same story I think but it’s about the same time frame. I had six to eight cops come to my house and futon and knocking on the door seven o’clock in the morning on like a nose.
[00:31:20] Oh, definitely a weekday was like a Tuesday at random day of the week and I was literally like in my in my boxers like in my underwear as like I popped open the door and they like kind of pushed in. And one has like a GoPro like you’re saying one has a camera and there’s like they’re like different outfits like different ones in the uniform was not in uniform like enter asking me for my ID and where the other foreigners were the other foreigners and because I will I registered but there was reports of other foreigners living with me and you want to know who you are know who the other foreigners work.
[00:31:57] My five-year-old my five-year-old and might [00:32:00] three-year-olds. Because they’re foreigners. So we didn’t register R2 kids and there’s so there was good. So it was like illegal illegal foreigners it living there and they were like where the foreigners and then my wife’s like yellowish easy on him and Chinese and it was because I didn’t register my two American kids if they were think they’d think I was like housing illegal illegals in why I’m out how she knows.
[00:32:25] It was so scary. I was like a scary and no but they’re like, oh sorry. Well, I like everything. Yeah stuff like that. So yeah, I mean you can but some. But yeah, I mean, I hopefully this podcast help. So do you have a campaign as of now? I mean, of course we’ll get this out right in the end a March or early April and it’s a GoFundMe campaign and what kind of targets and goals are you know where we’re trying to what’s the what’s the goal here was to achieve, you know, and maybe fill people in.
[00:32:58] I’m still from as far [00:33:00] as the amount so to appeal to the prosecution department and as well to file a separate case against him to support the appeal to the prosecution Department. I need around eight to ten thousand US Dollars and this the timeframe is about four months. So I’m working to see if I can get that timeframe shortened the lawyers.
[00:33:23] I’ve spoken to more lawyers than I know like I could possibly imagine in gender and I know I know a lawyer for every little little thing in life that you would ever need if anyone needs a lawyer come to me. Yeah. Sure. I think it would make a good directory there like an Excel sheet get us all. And and I think Tim I mean I’m confident now, but I’ve never had a single person tell me this is going to work.
[00:33:49] So in the back of my mind, I’m a little bit. I mean, I need to be a hundred percent honest with you. I’m a little bit scared that I’m gonna hack. You know, I’m gonna probably that’s not going to work and I’m just going to have to [00:34:00] end up pain which and the amount that I need. Oh in in order to get off The Blacklist is about 35 37.
[00:34:09] U.s. Dollars and it’s that amount of money that nobody has in their pocket, right? You don’t just have that many say, oh, there we go covered. You know, let’s carry on with life. Let’s go. It’s it’s the amount of money that and I don’t want to ask my friend for that. I don’t want to say can I take cuz I don’t want to stress the friends finances and say oh, you know, I’ll pay you back.
[00:34:31] This is where I got inspired to try to you know, be more creative to fix this kind of a problem, you know, and maybe use it as a way to you know, start something bigger. So that’s why I launched my launch my podcast during this time because I was like, maybe this is what I did with this is what what karma is trying to tell me to do is to hear me.
[00:34:49] I need to get my voice out there my message right. So I lost launch my own podcast. I have my my YouTube channel. I you know way back in the day. I used to upload little, you know, This [00:35:00] videos so I’ve restarted that but and the the series that I started was called stuck in China and it’s a positive series, you know showing China doing food in China traveling to the you know Beach areas, you know, seeing seeing some cool things that China has right, but it you know, I find that kind of its it adds a positive light to the whole situation.
[00:35:20] It keeps me positive keeps me moving. So, you know and and and the end of the day it’s you know, I’m creating content of doing something on Briana. I’m projecting to the world which is you know, I like that so it’s in a way. I mean, I’m hoping this is a blessing in disguise. I mean, I feel so far that it is.
[00:35:36] I don’t know if I’m going to end up having to pay that full amount. I’m of course. I’m praying that I don’t have to but. It’s what everybody is telling me Chinese an expat. That’s what that’s what they’re saying. So we’ll see right we’ll just use he will take it instead becomes. Well, then I see how it goes.
[00:35:54] I think you’re also trying to springboard into some some type of a group or [00:36:00] found twice a foundation or you know, there’s also like awareness I firework all I know there’s a lot so much content. I’ve been you have out there about all of this. Well, you know what? What’s yes, what what’s going to end goal or there’s ongoing think something that’s going to happen to or at least goal.
[00:36:18] So this is okay. So this might be a bit far-fetched. But hey, it’s good to have dreams right? It’s good sure. But this this this is what I think would be so useful. For the the expat community in all of China. I’d like to create and of course, I have to see how the hell do these all this fundraising.
[00:36:37] I’ve never run a crowdfunding campaign before my life. I had to study like a few months and read does a guy Salvador bring them. On YouTube. I basically just read and listened and watched all of his content to figure out how to do it. But I’m let’s get out the crowdfunding goes but my eventual but which I think would be fantastic for every expat in China.
[00:36:58] What would make them feel [00:37:00] much more safe and much more secure is an expat defense fund. So basically that it’s a fund. It’s like a we will have a board will have a you know, a group of people and we’ll have an amount will keep the funding going and it will be it’ll all be banked and people that are like expats that are in certain situations people that are you know, that like remember the American football player use in that type pickle, right?
[00:37:26] He was he got and now he has to do for years in jail because he couldn’t pay. I believe it was a hundred thousand us was the amount that that was his bail amount. So yeah, and I mean his situation is all over the internet as well and there’s a couple others right? But what if there was a defense fund an expat defense fund at this purely was was funded by the community of China by by foreigners and expats.
[00:37:51] I like anybody who. And in Chinese of course and it’s used and accessed at the times [00:38:00] when someone gets into a mess like this, right, of course, maybe there’d be an assessment process. You would assess the case. You would see the, you know, the validity of everything but but this is I don’t know.
[00:38:10] Like I said, it might be two bit of bigger the pie in the sky idea, but maybe there’s something there right? I there’s a guy. A really good friend of mine David Shoemaker. I’m not sure if you know, yeah, of course, but yeah, yeah. Yeah, he’s a he’s a veteran right? He’s been in it. Does this with he’s a swimmer?
[00:38:28] Yeah, he’s got the rim guy. Yeah the way All-Star way how I dare you hit me. Yeah him and his partner there. They’re trying to set up sort of an it’s like an ex Pats and expat liaise Club. It’s like it’s like a club where if when expats they’re there. They it’s sort of sort of a liaison to the government or to the court or to the police.
[00:38:52] Right? It’s a where people did he was like look I need some help. I know there’s some things I can’t figure out and This Club, you know, maybe. [00:39:00] The Deep the expat defense defense fund could be part of this club. So that’s something I’m talking to him and his partner about if we could. See, you know if we see make this but yeah, I mean this is all early stages course of course, but this is great things start starting.
[00:39:15] Yeah. This is I just got to put it out. You’re putting yourself out there, you know, you’re creating this content. Hopefully the show helps helps with the campaign. I was with the awareness and mean that’s what that’s what it’s really about. Yeah, of course. I’m so obviously really sorry to hear this.
[00:39:31] Is there any I mean most of all to be putting huge stress on your other everything you’re doing? I mean what what’s I’m what’s happened with the fight night for now I went with the wake is that going to be able to happen? I just. That’s exploding. That’s all. I’m just extremely busy right now. I’m running the campaign.
[00:39:47] Obviously. I’m trying to provide good content to my YouTube to my to my to my date the JG show on my podcast sure and we’ll look at the fun. We’re opening up a new office my. That the [00:40:00] investor group that’s invested in this idea. They’re excited. They’re pumped. I mean 2019 were probably by May will be running a like an in club what we term a silver fight event will be running them every single week.
[00:40:13] I mean, it’s going to be a busy year very busy year for WCF great deciding it’s good stuff and it’s it is something that is of course. I’m not it’s not a pleasing situation, but it’s sort of energized me a little bit. As I think this is the way my personality is is if I’m under a lot of stress or if I if I’m Puttin in a situation where there’s lots of pressure or it’s sort of a do-or-die actually operate a bit better.
[00:40:39] I get excited. I like it’s sort of that challenge mindset that I’ve had. You know doing Sport fitness, you know my whole life. So it’s good. I mean, I’m not going to sit here and say, oh it’s terrible, you know, it sucks. This sucks because it I just I refuse to think this way I went you wake up in the morning.
[00:40:55] You got to think this is good. I’m positive about this. Let’s go awesome. Let’s push whatever whatever [00:41:00] whatever you have to do that right? That’s that’s not I don’t consider that, you know there being any other choice. That’s what you got to do. So, yeah, I mean for me to close out the campaign, I’m not looking for a few donators to give a large amount of money.
[00:41:13] I’m looking for anybody who finds this content valuable who likes the message it’s five to ten bucks. That’s all. I mean, I don’t I mean if someone’s people giving a hundred so I mean I’ve had I’ve had a friend Gibbs $700. This is obviously extremely. Appreciate it. Yeah, and I’m I’m very very thankful.
[00:41:32] But 10 bucks goes a long way if I have 7,000 people give ten bucks. That’s or is it five bucks? My math is terrible covers my feet that covers the whole Blacklist feet, right? So I’m you know, do I believe I can you know could be I can actually reach out to 7,000 people. Of course. I can’t I believe I did is it just don’t take time to.
[00:41:55] You know, I’m not asking for large amounts of mine five to ten bucks is more than enough guys. I mean if [00:42:00] you know that that means the world to me sure and it’s credit card PayPal. I think you know any kind of most major payment any kind of nervous. Yeah, cool. And yeah. Thanks John for your time and.
[00:42:13] Also, I will link up all of this on the show notes and the campaign of course and and I’ll chip in a bit to me and I got I got my kids. I’m actually a little bit. You know, here’s I’ve heard of Other Stories the opposite where I people can’t come back to China. I’m I’m a little bit nervous. I might not be able to see get back.
[00:42:34] I don’t think I have anything wrong. But you know, there’s always that fear right like, you know, never had or have had nightmares on those where I go back to America. It’s never happened. But I go back to the US and they’re like, yeah, I’m American or like oh, did you pay your taxes all your taxes?
[00:42:46] Did you do this? You know, you know a lot of things, you know, it’s always scary. I mean, but I have heard stories of friends that can’t suppose I can’t go back to China because they had a company there and it didn’t close it correctly or. Millionaires, you [00:43:00] know what they got? Of course, they can come back but they gotta pay this huge amounts that are just like, okay.
[00:43:05] Yeah, they’re just like, you know what I’ll just write come back. So I hope I don’t get any but I do hope to come back soon and we gotta catch up and I walk or anywhere in the world and and thanks for sharing with with the audience today. And well, you know, we’ll just keep on what we’ve been chatting and so we’ll just keep in touch and let’s get this campaign fund.
[00:43:30] Thank you so much Mike. That’s a big help big big help. Thank you everybody for listening to thanks so much. All right, cool. Are you looking to grow your international business from Asia Amazon FBA import export and cross-border e-commerce are Trends in today’s world, especially here at Global from Asia.
[00:43:51] And we put together an ecourse ebook both actually all together for you for free with so fast track getting you [00:44:00] going global from Asia. Check it out at global forum ebook, you’ll get the book as well as an interactive e-course that will be catered based on how you answer the email Series.
[00:44:13] So I look forward to seeing you on the inside. Check it out Global formation slash ebook. Okay, that’s a wrap of episode 247 s interview John Graham Harper white-collar fight night. I did some video blogs with them too. And yeah, I mean this stuff is really scary. I don’t know how you feel about it.
[00:44:35] I you know, like I said intro I threw in $20. I wish I could throw in more my kids are eating all my food, you know School costs and life cause bought a car but. He’s not asking for a lot of money. He’s just wants a dollar from you know, and lesser amount of people and should be able to get something going.
[00:44:51] So, you know, if you got a book to share, you know, not even only likes asking how he likes. Nobody likes being in, you [00:45:00] know in that position, but maybe you can throw them a dollar. It’s a I paid with my credit card. You can do credit card or PayPal. I think there’s even other ways are maybe we chat pay or maybe add him or find them on his YouTube channel.
[00:45:13] And we chat Pam. I don’t know but the show notes has it as always Global from episode 247. And if you’re still with me listening, we got some announcements today the show. Well, I’m course recordings before the release dates. But this show went online April 2nd 2019, which is my birthday.
[00:45:35] And you know, I guess you can maybe try. You know, I’m not going to hide my birthday, but you can maybe crack into my security questions on my banking or do credit fraud. I mean, of course, it’s nerve-racking people always warned me. Don’t say too much stuff online, but. You know with voice recognition to you probably use this show to voice recognize me on telephone and use my birthdate.
[00:45:56] But 1981 was when I was born and my voice Probably sounds like I was born [00:46:00] in 1991, but I’m getting close to the 40s. That’s pretty crazy. I’m not in a midlife crisis yet. Maybe maybe the last few months was a midlife crisis in a way. But a lot of exciting things are happening, so it’s released on my birthday and I haven’t done it yet.
[00:46:16] But this weekend. My wife booked me a hotel and a family of four going to go to the resort and it’s it’s not just any Resort. It’s a resort where we plan to do the global from Asia boot camp the first one. It’s it’s if you’re on our email list, you might have gotten a few more emails than usual because we’re getting feedback and we’re.
[00:46:38] For developing this program and we’re building a platform here of learning platform a networking platform for people Amazon FBA course is the Hot Topic but international business business in Asia, you know, we’re working on getting even more amazing people there to share. It’s going to be more like a platform now we’re going to do because we’ve got insist overloaded with feedback people.
[00:46:58] I want Advanced PPC and [00:47:00] people that want the beginner and product sourcing and I don’t like just like the show you guys some different topics. Hopefully work some deals on you know, Frederick giant portal has been amazing and supportive of everything we do and many Welbeck far import Dojo has been great and so many others that want to help help get the word out and maybe do some kind of collaboration but the idea is we’re going to do.
[00:47:25] Basically kind of like a la carte menu where people can choose to instructor and/or choose the topic that they’re more interested in and we’re going to let people choose which ones they want to go to and which ones they don’t want to go to kind of like a credit system. So you’ll you’ll buy a pass to the global from Asia boot camp and then you’ll get any access into this boot camp.
[00:47:45] You’ll get a horse coffee tea and snacks and the and a lunch and you get access and then you’ll use your credits to go into certain. Rooms and you know, we’re going to try to book people in advance so that the sooner you confirm and is sooner you lock in your [00:48:00] your spots the more, you know likely you’ll be guaranteed to get that person in that topic and why multiple rooms and it’s going to be in these this resource pretty cool.
[00:48:09] It’s like a Botanical Garden. So you’ll be able to kind of go to different rooms. There’s lakes and there’s like different houses and hotels all different you take golf carts to get different places. So it’s going to be the pretty cool little platform that we’re working. On here and that’s one thing I’ve been also just so happy talking to these people that are willing to support us by sharing their knowledge and experience with others and we’re basically going to do like a profit share system or workload major will get a percent and the instructor will get a percent and then of course where the organizers there’s got to be some kind of Base fee to cover, you know, the food cost of Nu costs, but we’re trying to make this a transparent platform also with here different feedback of people.
[00:48:53] You know, I think we should pay the people sharing their experience or knowledge. So and also, you know be transparent about it [00:49:00] stairs. We don’t, you know, we just want to be open. So you as an attendee paying will be paying a course to support Global from Asia and the community and it’s events.
[00:49:11] But also you’ll be given some money to those people to have that experience in that not work and that knowledge and it’ll be like all kinds of different formats so July. And I realized rise conferences the same time that I had it and we gots all these different feedback of like Chris. Davey might not be in town.
[00:49:28] He’s in the states and we really want Chris to be able to make it and some others. So we’re pushing a little bit later. We said originally seven to the 13th, but if you probably will look by now. I’ve been updating our website a lot, but it’ll be on gold boot camp, but we’re looking like doing it the.
[00:49:45] 15 middle of July until like the 20th something like that. So the few days I’ve gotten people confirmed but luckily I got such amazing people in the community. We’re all being flexible, but it’s going to be a crazy [00:50:00] amazing calls. I mean, that’s what’s cool about, you know, putting yourself out there.
[00:50:04] I’ve connected with even more amazing people lately and economies of Mix-Ups of my email list a little bit with some segmentation issues if you’re listening, sorry about that, but. I am rambling here and I’m going to try to enjoy my birthday weekend. It’s coming up and it’ll be my birthday when it shows online.
[00:50:22] I love my birthday. So another birthday gift you could do for me, which is free after you contributed to John’s. Cause of being stuck in China give him five bucks or two bucks or a dollar is share my boot camp or our boot camp. I don’t want to be mine. I want to be ours and I want to be these amazing experts.
[00:50:43] I don’t want to be the guru. I told people people try to like Lorenzo. Thanks buddy. We had some calls and you’re an expert in funnels and marketing but I’m not a sales guy don’t want to promote me and say I’m the best Amazon person in the world. I’m the smartest guy get you out of top of Amazon and.
[00:51:00] [00:50:59] Days and all this stuff. I don’t really feel like saying that that’s not who I am. I’m a platform. I have no face. I have no face whether it whatever you want to say. I want to have other people I want to build up the community. I want to build up the experts we’ve had just such amazing people and they trust us.
[00:51:16] That’s what I think is most important. They’re like Mike. Hey, man, you don’t even gotta pay me. I like. Chris said that and Fernandez some others. They’re just like like, you know, it’s the first one. I know, you know, of course, I’d like to get paid or you know compensate me. But we’re here to support you and support goal from Asia and that just makes me feel so amazed but we’re just basically going to make it like a platform and if you can share it and maybe even or give us feedback.
[00:51:45] I got amazing feedback from the email subscribers who have some rough ones, but some people just said say hey Mike Matt, don’t be so sensitive. I want to go. I’m just not I’m in Europe that time or up, you know stuff like that. But if you’d like to say happy [00:52:00] birthday Mike good luck with the glow of major boot.
[00:52:02] Share it on your Facebook or whatever or email it to somebody think that might benefit here in Chiang Mai and mid-july. So the 19 I have a good feeling about this one. Of course. The first one is always most scary. And is it come back for Clique GFA and it seems like you guys are still listening, but this will be an amazing program and.
[00:52:24] It’s the outro so you could have skipped by now. You already heard interview with John. So if you’re still here, thanks, and these are getting longer, but you know what? I’m kind of caring less if you know, if you don’t like it. You don’t got us those, you know going to listen, but I’m going to stop anyway mate minutes.
[00:52:41] So this outro has been little bit too long and Alvin’s editing these so don’t want him to go crazy either. Thanks Alvin for editing. And yeah, go remit that HK is our sponsor and that’s how Alvin gets paid for editing these at least I think did you set up your bank payments? I know you’re asking which banks they have more than [00:53:00] BPI and BDO Alvin, so and I’m talking to you and but you could give this a nice show.
[00:53:07] It’s like that there are sponsoring their how you get paid and they accept different used it for Philippines bank accounts. So Philippines is a his crazy place man. It’s fun. But yeah, I mean the water system, what’s up with the water system in Manila crazy? All right. That’s it. See you guys later episode 247 on Mike’s birthday 38-year alive.
[00:53:36] Many more I think at least double that I hope but they can live the lady. See it get more info about running an international business, please visit our website at triple w dot Global from that triple w dot Global from Also be sure to subscribe to our iTunes feed. Thanks for tuning in.

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