Using Corporate Mindfulness to Go to the Next Level in your Global Business with Brandon Mehrgut

Michael MicheliniCulture (Lifestyle), Lifestyle, Podcast0 Comments

In today’s episode, we are talking about corporate mindfulness. Our guest Brandon Mehrgut is a registered Mindfulness Trainer who has designed unique programs that help clients develop mindfulness. I think this is very important and we are talking about how to do it to improve your business and productivity. Let’s tune in.

Topics Covered in this Episode

  • Intro Brandon

    We met back in 2014 or so both grinding it out in China and you have been on this mindfulness and meditation journey since then – can you introduce yourself to us a bit?

  • Mindfulness and Meditation for Business Leaders (aka Corporate Mindfulness)

    Your initial studies were on corporate mindfulness – can you explain what that is to people listening. Many of us think of meditation and often think of “woo woo” kind of hippy stuff – not really applied to business and corporate.

  • The goal of meditation - train our attention

    I’ve been going through your group and 1 on 1 training (we had a GFA VIP member session with you, and I have since been doing 1 on 1 virtual sessions with you which is awesome) – and I loved your input that the goal is to train our attention – can you expand on that.

  • Attention affects our choices, actions and our results come from that.

    Low attention skills means low quality choices, low quality action, low results. High attention skill means higher quality choices, higher quality actions, higher results. Love this!

  • The goal of a session

    What should someone work towards? Scan body, breaking, taking wandering mind and bringing back to the breath.

  • Maybe try a quick one for those listening / watching

    Let’s do a quick test live?

  • How you help business leaders

    I’d love to hear some cases and examples so people can learn

  • About your business and practice

    Tell us about what you are working on and the programs

  • You have a very generous offer, for a limited time

    I am having trouble believing this one, so we can’t leave it open forever – but you have an offer anyone who would want to make an improvement can take you up on (The free 1 on 1 session – maybe we need to have them fill out a form on our site and limit the time or quantity of people?)

  • How people can find you and your business online

    Where to reach you Brandon

People / Companies / Resources Mentioned in this Episode

Brandon’s VIP Page
√ Brandon’s website – Modern Mindfulness
√ Visit our GFA partner – Mercury – for US banking solutons for your ecommerce businesss

Episode Length 01:01:45

Thank you so much Brandon for sharing! I hope everyone enjoyed it. Corporate mindfulness – having a healthy mental state and keeping a focused mind, this has been helping me out the last few months, helping me work on being more effective.

Download Options

Listen in on Youtube

Show Transcript

[00:00:00] Episode 334 Global from Asia here. We are talking about corporate mindfulness and it’s an amazing one. Somebody has been coaching me about mindfulness meditation, and we’re going to talk about it and how to actually do it to improve, improve your business and productivity. Let’s dive in now.

[00:00:21] Welcome to the Global from Asia podcast where the daunting process of running an international business is broken down into straight up actionable advice. And now your host, Michael Michelini. Hi everybody. Thank you for choosing to listen to Global from Asia. I’m Michael Michelini here, your regular host. We are getting some guest hosts or some share-staging people.

[00:00:46] I don’t know if you’ve noticed in the last few episodes we’re bringing on GFAVIP members into these sessions. And we’re, we’re trying to actually have them network with some of the guests. Actually, a lot of the shows coming up, we already recorded. We’ve done some live streaming on YouTube and Facebook.

[00:01:01] And in this one we have Zac Zheng. Zac is an awesome guy. He’s helping co-host with me a little bit on the stage. And we have our guest, one, my coach for mindfulness meditation, corporate mindfulness, Brandon Mehrgut, and Brandon is amazing. Brandon M and in the whole, online marketing and podcasting world, like five, six years ago or so in China.

[00:01:27] And we’ve kept in touch and I’ve been so fortunate to go through some of his group coaching and his, his programs and it’s, it’s helped me. And I’m hoping to help you, you know, I try to take these amazing people, I mean these amazing things I learn and bring them on the show for you to you know, listen, watch network learn from, connect with, and I do hope this helps you.

[00:01:50] You know, I know, I do feel like some of the shows lately have not been about like traditional business and traditional, you know, uh, growth, hacks and marketing, but I think these are very, very important. I mean, I was working with somebody I’ve been coaching for their e-commerce business and, you know, he’s, he’s totally overloaded and sometimes you just got to take it step-by-step and I think this meditation mindfulness helped me so much.

[00:02:14] I’ll talk about it after, after the interview, I’ll do a little bit of talk about how I do it and to you know, I’ll explain what I’ve been going through. You know, we’ve also had some other people I’ve worked with for a meditation and mindfulness as well. Earlier this year it’s been a year for transition

[00:02:32] So I think this stuff is important. You know, I know you might think it’s woo-hoo and not helping you increase your sales, but I think it’s very important and we are Asia after all, you know, it’s it’s about meditation, mindfulness controlling your monkey mind. So let’s, let’s dive into the show with Brandon.

[00:02:49] Do you need USA banking for your e-commerce or internet business? is a new sponsor supporter GFA partner. And it’s really great to have them. They are an online banking solution and we’re applying for that in our new Amazon business. We also have a bonus where you can get $250 cash for some certain terms and conditions.

[00:03:11] And we’ll also get a little bonus for ourselves. If you want to check it out, we’re going to have it on the show notes and at And you’ve also seen also to get that special, opt-in to get the $250. So thank you, mercury. And I really recommend checking them out for your USA online bank, no need to

[00:03:30] go there. Okay. We are live. This is back to back sessions here, and we just had an amazing one about. Digital identities, owning your own data and the big guys owning your data. It’s a singles day. One, one, one, one November 11th. This is I’m getting excited, you know, and also we got webinars tomorrow for Amazon managing or managing your Amazon tasks and business.

[00:03:55] This is gonna be an amazing one. We have two sessions and I am, we are getting the people here. And, yeah, so is where you can, you know, people are coming in now, is where you can get the information to schedule. If you’re enjoying this, there is a little bit of a like button, click the like button, click the subscribe button.

[00:04:21] We are having people joining now. Okay. Brandon’s here. Okay. Let me up, invite him up on stage. It makes him on video. There it is. There you are. Yay. Cool, cool. Perfect. All right. Right. I, I mean, man, I’m sorry. It’s 6:00 AM your time, buddy, very early.

[00:04:43] I forget about daylight savings and you know, with China, doesn’t follow that. And so. I’m actually bringing up Zac Zheng. Zac also, he’s doing Tai Chi and he’s in our community. So I, he’s, he’s interested just kind of hanging out with us on, on the show. We’re also streaming this on Facebook right now on YouTube.

[00:05:09] And, so of course a podcast and a recorded session too. But I’m really excited, man. I. I, I have to, I feel bad though. I missed my afternoon session today, my meditation session, the mid-day I’ve missed at least one a week. I miss. But, but yeah, Brandon’s been coaching me. Amazing. For a couple, few months now actually has been like two or three months.

[00:05:36] I guess and, but let’s, let’s, let’s get in I’m I’m inviting Zac up on the stage. I don’t know if he sees it. Zac, if you see an invite, you got to accept it. Hopefully it works. Do you see the invite? I could reinvite you it’s pending or I can cancel. Resend the invite. Okay. So. So Brandon. Yeah, I mean, it’s fun.

[00:06:04] I can’t believe I haven’t had you on this podcast before we even had a mastermind about podcasts before, and we’re both content creators and, and you’re such a generous person with what you do in your community at modern mindfulness, we met, I think it was 2000. Hey, Zac made it awesome. And Zac Zac’s in London and Brandon’s in Austin, Texas.

[00:06:28] Right. And I’m here China. Yeah. So yeah, Zac is in Tai Chi and I invited him to come on here and he can also give us some, some insights and questions for you. But we met in 2014, actually. I also met Zac about that time too. And, and you were in Shanghai, you mostly been in Shanghai. You’re going through quite a transition this year, right here.

[00:06:52] You were in the US for Chinese new year or a holiday or maybe a little bit. Your story, your 2020 story, Brandon, if you, if you want to share. Yeah, sure. So I was in, I was in China in January, so it’s almost January again. And, the coronavirus pandemic has just started and I had been living in China for about 10 years.

[00:07:24] So it was always part of the plan to come back to the U S but it wasn’t, it just seemed like one suitcase type of plan. And that’s how it, I ended up. So the border was closing, so I wanted to make sure that me and my wife would get into the US without any problems. So we had our, we had on back and we ended up in Louisiana.

[00:07:47] Then we realize that Austin, Texas was a bit more dynamic or progressive. So we ended up moving here, with all of the, all the, all of that said and done. We’ve been here for about three months and we kind of like settled here for about three months. So it’s kind of like a strange transition, limbo period, but life has begun again.

[00:08:14] Finally. Got it. Yeah. I know I’ve been following your journey and your videos on wechat and, and, in your groups. So, yeah, I mean, but that’s why we need what you’re doing. You’re doing core mindfulness, but, I guess today we’re gonna, we’re a business community. So corporate mindfulness, which is what you’re trained in, right?

[00:08:36] Like, let’s talk a little bit about some of your, your background, your expertise. Yeah. Sure. So when I, when I first arrived in Shanghai, um, I noticed that they were not offering any kind of mindfulness services or meditation classes and in the way that the West portrays it. So we began that. As an organization called Shanghai mindfulness.

[00:09:01] And I asked myself the question, what is the most professional way to teach this and learn it. And I found the organization potential project, and I worked with them for about three years and they taught me a lot about how to portray this in a corporate aspect to where mindfulness is, and mindfulness training is in direct relation to.

[00:09:27] Results. And there are many different ways to frame mindfulness and meditation. However, I found that the, the frame and relation to performance enhancement is most palatable for people. Most of the time when it comes to meditation, you have, obviously the traditional approach and or religious approach, then you have more spiritual aspect to it.

[00:09:56] And then you have the performance enhancement approach, which are all of these modern applications, these things, these days, but it can be like drinking water through a fire hose, so many different options. And with corporate mindfulness training, one of the fundamental teachings that we share is basic mindfulness training or basic mindfulness meditation has a direct relation to your ability to be attentive.

[00:10:25] To what is now, and the way that we really linked this is that our attention affects our choices. Our choices affect our actions and our actions affect our results. Therefore, there’s a direct correlation with high attention span and high results. When we’re training from this meditation, this is increasing our capacity.

[00:10:51] To be attentive to what we would like to be seeing so much information all day long. I agree. Oh yeah. I mean, like I said earlier, I’m going through your program now and, uh, you know, a lot of, a lot of times people think meditation or, you know, they don’t have time. Like even me, like I admitted, I missed a little bit today.

[00:11:15] It was just back to back calls and then I got my midday, but I definitely been doing, I’ve been doing morning meditation since like, you know, I learned from Pat Flynn, Tim Ferriss back in 2013 or 14. And, but yeah, you’ve got me into the mid day and I love that because it also just breaks my day up.

[00:11:35] Like we’ve, we’ve had some conversations about, you know, the maker and the manager mode, so it kind of just resets my day and then I just, but yeah, I love the idea, like you just said attention. Meditation and the, the what’s that the monkey mind, you know, like I think of, Oh man, how can I forget his name?

[00:11:59] Anthony, Anthony Robbins. No, Tony, Tony Robbins. Tony Robbins. Yeah. I mean he says, yeah man, I’m blanking on this now I forgot the name and I forgot what he was saying, but, you know, it’s about. Sorry to interrupt there, there’s a book. It’s a book called the Chimp paradox, I believe, which basically talks about that.

[00:12:25] About the, this kind of animal was the one. Yeah, that’s it? Yeah. He says we’re like primitive, right? Like we’ve had this 5,000 years brain of like flight or fight, you know, like we see. We see something and we, we eat it or we run away from it, you know, something like that, you know? And, even though we’re in this new world, we still have that like primitive brain.

[00:12:54] I think that’s what I meant from the Tony Robbins quote. I remember seeing him talk about that. That’s exactly right. And it’s so important to give us as a, as a species, as human beings, important to give us the benefit of the doubt that our minds are wired for survival and not happiness. Yeah, it is everything that’s going on right now.

[00:13:16] And your body’s trying to keep you alive. And when you’re looking at mindfulness training, this is something that really is groundbreaking far in terms of the neurological research behind it, because we’re starting to actually change the way that the brain works specifically in regards to the dorsal lateral prefrontal cortex.

[00:13:41] And. And, and, and capacities, emotional regulation and empathy, emotional intelligence, many different aspects of, of the way that your brain works. And a perfect example of this monkey mind that we always talk about is that when you wake up. For example, I woke up about an hour ago. And when you wake up, you have a hormone called cortisol and actually released at a large amount.

[00:14:15] This is a stress hormone. And one of the repercussions of this release has you searching for fruit? Another one may seem more alert. Well, that will be really useful. 5,000 years ago, 2000 years, 20,000 years ago, which our brains are no different from they are today. And what people are doing when they’re waking up in the morning is checking their phone.

[00:14:47] They’re checking their most important task of the day when they have this high amount of stress. And then they’re associating this stress with the rest of the day, let’s say you get an email from a key business partner and things aren’t working out right now. You’re taking that stress with you. And when you’re not cultivating mindfulness, it’s, it’s unconscious stress.

[00:15:10] So your day sucks already. You don’t know why. So it’s really, really important to understand this monkey mind before it makes the tool out of us. So we use the tool of mindfulness training, so we don’t become a tool. Yeah, I like it. I mean, yeah. You’ve seen my rabbit in some of the sessions and the rabbit, you know, he sees me go towards him.

[00:15:35] He’s like trying to run away scared, you know, he’s like, and I try to give him a food and then he sees the food and he’s like, not trusting me. And he’s looking at the food he’s looking at me. He’s like, yeah, this is even the human mind. Right. Like, Zac do you have something you want to ask or I can maybe, maybe. It’s, it’s great to be able to speak to you today.

[00:15:57] Brandon, I’m very excited to speak to them about mindfulness, as you know, I think there wouldn’t be anyone to talk about mindfulness in e-commerce space. That was quite a, quite a surprise. I guess I’m really interested if we mix it up here. Yeah. Brilliant. Brilliant. And also Brandon’s got such great aura is clear that case.

[00:16:20] Very, yeah. Okay. He’s got hold of his monkey brain sometimes. Yeah. So you mentioned that, I think with corporate stats, mindfulness it’s about performance improvements. And I think maybe they implied that, maybe ROI is important for corporate, corporations. I mean, why would they spend the money and resources for their employees to do this?

[00:16:46] So I’d be interested to hear how you were able to kind of, sell on those points on, on kind of quantifiable improvements. Sure. So when we’re looking at ROI, some research that potential project has done is that it increased focus. The studies that they’ve done, they’ve increased focus by about 42%.

[00:17:08] And they’re simple studies that have been done all around the world. Where do you have a particular program that you’re working on and particular program that you’re using and it’s being monitored? And every single time that you switch a task, this is being monitored. And what the studies are showing is that through mindfulness training, you’re having less unconscious task.

[00:17:31] Switching. Multitasking is a total myth. The brain is really a one road, one way route and every single time you’re switching a task, you’re actually losing momentum. Now, well, one of the things that we teach in corporate mindfulness training is okay. If you’re going to switch tasks, that’s great, but do it mindfully and do it wholly

[00:17:56] So wholeheartedly. When you’re switching a task, let’s say you’re working with sending a very, very important email, and then you get a call from a customer. And this is something that you’re consciously thinking, okay, is right now the best time to take this call? Or am I just reacting, looking for dopamine releases along the way, looking for small wins, so to speak?

[00:18:21] So this is one of the ways that we measure this and, in a corporate context, among many, many others, a very tangible way on a long-term study is just seeing that people aren’t getting sick as much. They’re not burning out as much, retention rates are increasing, increasing because there’s less stress.

[00:18:47] The immune system becomes hard, due to the less stress people are staying on longer. They’re not getting burned out. That’s a big, big part of the e-commerce world. And I happen to know a little bit about the e-commerce role because I’ve been helping out my, one of my buddies, he, was actually a student of mine and, he has an Amazon account, Chinese, Chinese student.

[00:19:10] And, I’ve noticed like, wow, this is like, as Mike said, a gladiator. Yeah. Yeah. And, and you know, this guy, he, he meditates for 20 to 30 minutes a day, but he never turns off, you know, and we need as entrepreneurs, as people in this gladiator, gladiatorial, is that the thought, the word or word, arena? We need the tool to be able to manage this stress.

[00:19:46] Skillfully and we know that physical exercise, is there a fun fact to go for a jog, uh, eight years ago? That, that wasn’t cool. Like if you saw me running down the street 80 years ago, you would say, what is he running from now? If you see me running down the street, depending on what I’m wearing, you’ll say, Oh, good job for that guy.

[00:20:11] If I’m wearing a suit for my fear, a different story. So. There are many different ways to, to measure that and to work, uh, on oneself, through mindfulness training. And it’s not just limited to the corporate aspect either. One of the areas that I do work on as well is with law enforcement and, uh, certain government agencies, uh, to help them with their.

[00:20:44] Mental resilience. I’ve done a little we’ll work with the FBI and the local governments, uh, where I’m from Louisiana. And it’s really important to be present when you’re, you’re dealing with such high stress situations. And one of the reasons why this is a. Popular is that mental wellness in regards to the e-commerce space?

[00:21:12] You know, a lot of guys, fairly competitive it’s um, it’s not cool. It’s been taboo, mental wellness, and it’s something that people really need to open up. And mindfulness allows us to speak in regards to mental wellness and a performance enhancement frame. It’s like, bro, Zac. You’re great, man. You’re great, great.

[00:21:37] Nothing wrong with you. Thank you. But by doing mindfulness training, it’s going to make you even better. Whereas when you’re looking at like a therapeutic approach or, or a clinical psychological approach, this is, Oh, there’s something wrong with me now I need help. When the mindfulness training frame is more of

[00:22:03] We’re going to, we’re going to make you strong while you’re already strong. We’re gonna make you stronger while you’re you’re already strong. So it’s a bit, yeah. More palatable for people. Yeah. That’s amazing. Yeah, like I’ve been, I’ve been going through it. I’ve been going through with them for a few months.

[00:22:21] And that’s why I was like, man, we haven’t got we’ve you felt like you’ve almost already helped us with our community in GFAVIP, but I haven’t gotten down to the show. And then, but another thing I, like, what you’ve taught me is you don’t try to just get the thoughts out. It’s not like something to get rid of, you know, we’re all.

[00:22:39] Our brains are just thinking and thinking, but it’s more just being aware of all these thoughts, because meditation, I used to try to, like, somebody else taught me once was like, you treat it like a cloud and try to push these thoughts out of your brain. But you said just let them like settle and, uh, hoping, not giving, revealing too many secrets.

[00:23:00] But, well I know the book, Secret to this. There’s no secret. You’re right. Everything you’ve said, I agree with it. But, yeah, I mean, that’s helped me because I used to think I was doing it wrong. Cause I’m you know, I’m trying to meditate and I’m just sitting there and I’m thinking and I’m, but you’re sustaining by being aware that you’re saying.

[00:23:18] You’re overthinking or that you’re just, it’s true. Like by me, just accepting that I, my brain is like thinking about, I need this email and this project and this project supply chain problem in my factory. And there’s this problem. And just by being aware of that and digesting it, and it’s settling in your brain, like, lets you attack it better after you’re done with this, you know, there’s meditation is what I’ve noticed.

[00:23:44] That’s exactly right. And it’s important to, with that, not to get too like philosophical. Um, but it’s important to realize and understand how this monkey mind works. So, is it okay if we do two little, experiments, I’ll take about 30 seconds. Yeah. Yeah. Let’s do it, man. Yeah. And then if anybody watching live or on recording, you can follow, right?

[00:24:14] Like we can still do it. They’re listening or watching, feel free to join guys on Facebook, live and YouTube and every other channel that people are tuning in on. So us it, you guys are all ambitious people is e-commerce we all very driven people. So we like a lot of challenges. Right, right. Yeah. For sure.

[00:24:38] Here’s a little bit of a challenge too. Focus on one thought for just 30 seconds. And in order to help you do this, you can. We focused on a static image in your mind, whatever you want, but just hold that image in your mind for 30 seconds. And we’ll see how it goes just

[00:25:10] up to you. If you want to keep your eyes open. All the more, it’s going to be much more difficult. You close your eyes. You’ll be able to really hold an image for 30 seconds. Just to clarify on that. Is it any image or is it like a goal or aspiration? Anything and anything you want? Just okay. One thought.

[00:25:30] Cool. Ready? Yeah. All right, let’s go. You’re going to time it for us or? Yeah. Great. Two, one. Just think of one thought. Go.

[00:26:09] All right time. Okay. So who succeeded? Unfortunately I got nervous. I’m like, Oh man, is it 30 seconds yet?

[00:26:24] I think I, I went back to the thought at least twice, but I did gear off a little bit. I think it’s okay. Actually, I don’t know how the stack is a static image. It’s more of a, I visualize a big Oak tree to, yeah. Yeah. So you practice Tai Chi. This probably be a live after meditation on and off about six, seven years.

[00:26:52] So, okay, so cool. Now, now we’re gonna, we’re gonna do the opposite. You and you probably done this in childhood, which is always fun. The childhood games. Now I invite you to think of anything you want. To thinking before all you can think all you like, however, God forbid do not think of a, cause it gonna be specifically hard for Mike.

[00:27:22] Do not think of a white bunny, in a black top hat with a Monocle, with a black monocle and a cane. You can’t think of a bow, a white bunny and a black top hat wearing a monocle and a cane. You can think of anything else, but just, don’t think of a white bunny with a huge, crazy black hat and a monocle and a King. Okay. Oh, the instructions.

[00:27:52] It’s clear 30 seconds again. We’ll see how long. Okay, so just don’t think of this. Ready. Three, two, one, please do not think of a white bunny in a blacktop black Monocle and black cane. Okay. Go.

[00:28:25] okay. I’m not going to even go for 30 seconds. You see how difficult this is? Yes. I think maybe you tripped us. There’s no trick. It’s your mind. Okay. So your, your mind 100% has an mind of its own. Just so much your thoughts have a mind of its own. Just so much as your breath is breathing itself, your ears are hearing themselves.

[00:29:00] Your eyes are seeing what they see your heart is beating itself. This is something that is happening to you right now. And. It is very, very random and it continues on all day long, all night long. And we are under the illusion that we have more control over for this, this thinking mind than we really do.

[00:29:30] However, here’s the good news. What we do have control over and what can be trained is our attention and our awareness. So what we are aware of. And here what we are attentive to and here are out there in every aspect of our life and basic mindfulness training helps enhance that. So it’s really, really important for everybody to understand the viewers is that the mind does have a mind of its own, and this can be trained.

[00:30:07] Absolutely. I mean with me, because I’ve done mindfulness for, for a while now, uh, joining that into exercise, I was thinking, okay, I’m supposed to know what to think about X and the rabbit, so I’ll just calm down and then I’m thinking, what am I supposed to do? Nothing about the rabbit. Okay. That’s not thinking by the rabbit and calm down.

[00:30:28] It can sound kind of cycling between me wanting to relax. And putting things down and try to remember what am I supposed to do, which obviously it goes against, I mean, it’s almost impossible to do that while thinking it right. It’s we don’t try not to think of something it’s really. Yeah. Yeah. Well, what I try to do is I tried to think of the previous session of that session again, and just focus on something else.

[00:31:00] Hmm. So that’s what I tried to do. Okay. And it’s the same thing that a lot of people and beginning meditation, they struggle with this. They try to clear the mind. And if you try to clear the mind, you’re actually going to disturb it all. The more we don’t try to clear the mind, we don’t try to achieve anything we’re in meditation, which is another huge.

[00:31:25] Challenge is that for ambitious business owners, you’re flipping everything that you’ve ever, ever, ever learned and known on its head. So in meditation, we are to not try, we are to not strive or not try to achieve. And you cannot imagine how this is great for creativity. So it’s actually the process of meditating process of training.

[00:31:51] The mind that has been official, not the actual outcome. Of it. Now that being said beyond mindfulness training, the outcome is obviously very, very important. The results are important. However, during the training itself, it’s about the training, not the outcome. So if we’re sitting there trying to not think, not think a clear the mind or increase our focus, actually the opposite will happen.

[00:32:17] Hmm. Do you find in your mind is training like that? Sorry, I think I’m getting a feel for, do you find that with your mind for trainings, for example, if at 10 people, do you find that some of those people would just pick it up really quickly? They’re able to be mindful and calm down, et cetera, but maybe just one or two of them just find it exceedingly hard to do it.

[00:32:40] Absolutely. And how do you deal with that kind of the different progression that people makes? That’s a great question. Um, I would say that.

[00:32:55] First of all, I, I thoroughly believe after over 15 years of teaching this and six years of doing it full-time as a job that some people are very ready. To start this journey of mindfulness training and some people aren’t that ready. They’re not that willing and ready and they’re not aware of how, how much time it actually requires.

[00:33:27] Just like any other physical training, this requires time, just like for Tai Chi. You’re not going to go and just do one session for 30 minutes and your like, all right, TAi Chi master. This is how it works, right? This is something that takes weeks and weeks. And what most of the studies show is that you’re going to see a lot of changes, specifically, neurological changes at the 10 week Mark, 10 weeks.

[00:33:56] Okay. We really let people know that in around 10 weeks of mindfulness training, you’re going to start seeing a lot of benefits specifically when you’re hitting the minimum effective dose. The minimum effective criteria of, let’s say 10 minutes a day for approximately five days a week for 10 weeks, or does it make a simple 10 minutes a day for 10 weeks, 10, 10.

[00:34:24] That is the minimum minimum. If I go to the gym and just show up and walk on the treadmill for 20 minutes to say, all right, that’s it. And it’s a lifelong training. Really is, as we develop and, and face other life situations, some people have very, very, very active minds. And one of the things Zac, that I tell them that struggle the most is if you find mindfulness training easy, is there something that your, your calm onto you’ll be a part of and you’ll learn very well.

[00:35:06] You find it difficult. You’re going to benefit the most, no pain, no gain. If the mind is very, very busy, you are actually receiving the most benefit from mindfulness training. Why? Because those thoughts were always there. You’re now just aware of them. The peripheral silence. Isn’t cult, isn’t creating more thoughts.

[00:35:33] It’s that you’re not aware of the thoughts and that you have a method to start to deal with that. So I let people who were having specific challenges know that, and just come with it, come with an open heart and open mind. And if, if people have questions. To help. And also from a facilitator’s point of view, when people are ready, they’re ready.

[00:35:58] And, and quite frankly, some, sometimes people are just not ready to, to devote that time with themselves. And that’s okay because you are facing, when you, when you turn your attention inward, you’re facing reality. Yeah, that can be tough for many people. You’re facing your dreams, your ambitions, your fears, your uncertainties, everything, because this creates that.

[00:36:32] So I have so much respect for anybody watching Mike Zack for you guys, having this conversation. Really, you know, when you, when you practice mindfulness meditation, um, and, and many other meditations and Tai Chi, when you’re going within you’re facing your own reality, that’s one of the reasons why we sit up straight, more practicing dignified position of competence and confidence.

[00:37:05] So you’re not going to face reality like this. Yeah. Awesome. Yeah. So, I mean, I’m, I’m, I’m loving the mid day ones that you got me into and it’s, it’s, it’s almost better than taking a nap, right? Like some people say, take a power nap, but like a meditation gets me more energy than like a nap, right. Like kind of refreshes my day. It breaks it up. And then, you know, a lot of people feel like they don’t have time.

[00:37:33] But it easily, it makes you more effective. So I am able to get more done when I’m working and focus on one thing at a time, which is like what you’re saying. And Mike, I know that you’re supposed to be interviewing me, but I w I wanted to ask you a little bit, you know, what you told me during our sessions was incredibly valuable for me, the maker and the manager schedule, and not everybody knows that.

[00:38:00] And I wonder if you could just elaborate just a little bit as to how you use that and how you implement meditation with it. Cause I think a lot of people could use this, uh, a lot of entrepreneurs out there, a lot of hustlers out there. Yeah. Okay. I love too. So yeah, I mean, I’m a productivity junkie and I’m trying to always optimize my work and I, I re I read it from a Paul Graham article and I’ll, I’ll, I’ll try to remember to put it in the show notes, but basically the idea is maker versus manager.

[00:38:30] And like he’s talking about it from a startup or a Tech Venture, where does a tech co-founder and a business co-founder and a business co-founder is like the, the manager that does the phone calls and he does all the different, uh, you know, he does all the kind of like talking to people because talking to people is management and it breaks up your day, a lot, or a developer or a programmer can’t really.

[00:38:52] They’re not social because they got to do like a two, three, four hour block of work. If somebody does like a meeting with them, they break up their day and it screws up their flow state. Right. But I try to do both. I try to be a maker and a manager. So what I did is I. I just do my morning is my maker time.

[00:39:10] So that’s where I create a lot as content, you know, creating all this blog, working with my team, creating out processes, videos. That’s my morning. And then I switched to manager mode, which is phone calls, these podcasts, these different sessions, um, which are like more on and off kind of stuff. And then.

[00:39:29] That I didn’t do the meditation in the middle of it, but now what I do is I use the mid day meditation, like usually before it’s actually become after lunch. Now it used to be before lunch, but now I after lunch and, uh, it, it, I used to get tired in the afternoons. Like I, I would be a man at manager mobile.

[00:39:46] I would get kind of like low energy on these calls, even as sessions. But now I get like a little bit more boost of energy because it helps to, uh, You know, really just what meditation does, right. Is it kind of like digest my thoughts and lets me settle my thoughts. So that then, um, I’m like refreshed to go back into the man manager mode, which hit and phone calls hitting my email box, you know, hitting my, uh, chats, uh, we chats and all these group messages and these different things.

[00:40:15] So that it’s really helped me a lot. So I implement corporate mindfulness that you’ve been helping me with with this maker manager. Uh, and that combined has made me much more impact impactful in my day. Just great, man. It’s such a tangible takeaway. You know, I really love that. Um, I didn’t know if so for so long now, I would always take a call at any time.

[00:40:44] During the day, I mean, after my, my morning meditation session, and then I might have to create some content or this or that, but to really try to compartmentalize it and use mindfulness training as a way to shift the thinking and the shift, the mindset, and also from an energy conservation point of view, it.

[00:41:07] It allows you to have such higher awareness of where you are putting your energy out, because you only have so much energy throughout the day. You only have so many decisions you can make throughout the day, and then you just start to get exhausted. Exhausted. So, yeah. Thank you for sharing that. No, for my fisherman.

[00:41:28] Yeah, I mean, this was all about us helping her out, so let’s, let’s talk about. Um, some things that you been doing, so it’s modern, Greek Greek domain. And so it’s Shanghai mindfulness. And then I don’t know if we talked about the transition, but you’re, you’re going global. You’re doing more online.

[00:41:51] I guess we all have to do online. Just like today’s sessions, um, the business, you know what you’ve been building, what, where you’re at now, like what you’re doing. Yeah, I can, I can talk about the business aspect of it, how to too. So in the beginning we were just called Shanghai mindfulness. We call that because the service simply didn’t exist in the largest city, in the world.

[00:42:13] And from a marketing point of view, I asked myself, all right, if somebody wants my service, what are they going to search for? What are they going to do? It’s like thing, number one, they’re gonna turn their head and ask the person next to them. Hey, do you know? Like I’m not. Not feeling well, are I found that, uh, mindfulness can increase my focus and all these other guys practice mindfulness.

[00:42:36] I’d like to do it too. Do you know where I could find this? Or they might search online? Yeah, hence the name Shanghai mindfulness. And we had local classes in Shanghai and we’re about to have them again very, very soon. We’ve met a great partners in Beijing, also in Suzhou, right outside of Shanghai, for, for mindfulness retreats.

[00:43:00] And we have a really vibrant community of about 3000 people in Shanghai. Most of them are English speaking, Chinese and expatriates. We’re always nourishing these communities and having meetups and really when you’re ready and such a hardcore city, such as Shanghai, we made this modern mindfulness community for people to be around other like-minded people that have very healthy mindsets that can help one another.

[00:43:32] Now moving forward, modern mindfulness is a more international approach and it’s really funny, uh, the, the way the name came about as well. Um, I’ll tell you the marketing point of it, and then the more practical approach of it. I was talking to really great mindfulness teacher out of Hong Kong, one of the most famous ones in China and Hong Kong, uh, in my opinion, and.

[00:43:59] He looked at me cause I’m like a marketing guy, you know, I’ve always have been my dad’s in advertising and that’s what I studied too. Uh, he looked at me and he said, we’re at this restaurant. He said, Brandon, you understand modern mindfulness is different. People really. They need to be able to put their devices down and just focus on themselves.

[00:44:21] And I looked at him, I said, what did you just say? I sit down and focus on themselves. No, no, no. Say exactly what you said just the way you said it. Brandon modern mindfulness is different. And I looked at him and I said, I have to go to the restroom. I went to the bathroom and I go, one of my phone, I’m looking at domain names.

[00:44:42] I’m like, Oh shit, this is available. I need to, use this, because I had always been looking for a name or that name. And so I found that one. It’s easy to remember. It’s quite practical. I, I believe mindfulness will always be relevant for people. And the second reason why we came towards this name is that in China, there exists no word for mindfulness.

[00:45:11] There are two that come close, but no cigar. One is Zhengnian and Chinese speakers please correct my pronunciation, Zhengnian, this means correct view or right mindfulness. And this comes directly from Buddhism. That’s not what we’re teaching here. The second war that comes close is Jim Kwan, Jin Kwan. And this means to be, uh, aware of the mind.

[00:45:39] Where thought, however, this is not what Western mindfulness is about. It’s being aware of thought nonjudgmental. So we always had this problem whenever we were translating, uh, mindfulness into Chinese and people were like, Oh, should we put chinny, chin, chin Hawaiian? And I just told them, I said, just put mindfulness and English, the actual word of mindfulness.

[00:46:04] I think we lost Mike. I don’t know. He’s here and I was coming back. All right. It’s back. So I didn’t have, I’m hearing me here. No worries. So we didn’t have the word, uh, for mindfulness. And what I started telling people is that we’re teaching a modern version of an ancient tool and we were just using mindfulness training.

[00:46:27] Yes. Buddhism has a strong Zhengnian, they have a strong emphasis in mindfulness, but also many other traditions, uh, lineages have strong emphasis on mindfulness. For example, one another one that I practice is stoicism, huge emphasis on mine and fullness in the present moment, too. This is why the name came about and where we’re at right now is that because of COVID, we have totally changed everything we’re doing in the way we do it.

[00:47:01] So we switched to a, more of a membership model where we’re delivering mindfulness coaching to people. So we’re getting them up to speed and helping them practice every single day where this were the lies. The challenge with mindfulness training. It’s not the actual method, but learning to do this skill every single day.

[00:47:22] So I spent a large amount of my time coaching people on that and coaching people on the competency of mindfulness meditation. Having put everything online, it has. Shown a lot of challenges for us, but also I would say that COVID had been a forced innovation here in Austin, Texas. We haven’t started to release our services yet into the market.

[00:47:50] Number one being we’re still very much so in a pandemic and people are. Not meeting up. And number two is that I’d say we’re at the final phases of piloting our new programs that have been running in China and the Eastern part of the world. And I’m, I’m really, really just so grateful for the people that have helped me along this journey, along this transition.

[00:48:16] And just to name a few, Jonathan and New York and, so, so, so many different, uh, Johnny from Belgium, he’s in Shanghai right now. There’s so many different people that have helped tremendously and you guys also are helping as well. Um, so when I’m entering a new market, which I am here in the United States of America, I’m looking not at how can I create or share my brand.

[00:48:50] I’m never looking at that. I’m looking at how can I solve this problem that my nation and many other nations around the world are under a global mental health crisis. This is a, this is a really, really difficult time for many people. And. I asked myself, this question is how do we share mindfulness in a way that’s cool.

[00:49:15] It’s relevant for people that really resonate with people and just like when we started back in Shanghai to go a very, very valued for approach and we have a community number, this is a new little platform here in America. Where you can actually opt in on a service and you’ll get free mindfulness, text messages, every single day, little reminders.

[00:49:43] And from a marketing point of view, it’s a really great service because it goes straight to the end user’s attention. Whereas on Facebook, you have to shift through the information. We chat even more. So. LinkedIn, but people generally always see a text message. So we’re always sending little mindfulness reminders here in the U S and we’ve been doing this in China for a very, very long time.

[00:50:13] And also just understanding the market, uh, currently here in Austin, I see what’s being offered. They have. Mindfulness being portrayed in the therapeutic approach and the spiritual approach, but not the performance enhancement approach. So we really see that as well as a great way to get in, in the market.

[00:50:36] Start helping people here and also around the United States and around the world as well. Awesome, man. I’m really happy to see your yeah. I mean, yeah. I mean, don’t want to want to talk COVID too much, but I mean, it’s forced us all to re readjust. I mean, everybody and you, you you’re, it looks like you’re.

[00:50:54] Yeah. I mean, it looks like it has helps you in way. Positive way. I mean, in, as far as business forcing you to broaden your reach and help more people, especially with, like you said, I mean, people are under huge pressure right now, their lives, their family, you know, there’s a lot of horrible things happening and yeah.

[00:51:10] And you’re able to help them, uh, get through that time. So, um, really brand has been amazing and it’s bright and early. And I, I hope you did your meditation before, but it’s still early. So maybe you’re doing it after for us, for us today. Um, Yeah. So what, uh, I, I, I’m afraid to say it, but I think you have some one-on-one sessions.

[00:51:31] Yeah. Some sessions people could, could take you up on, I don’t want us to, you know, we’re in November, 2020, you’re probably gonna be super busy suing them. I, the way it sounds, but I think you’re, you have some, what are some ways people can engage with you and your community, you know, that are interested today.

[00:51:48] Yeah, for sure. I thank you for that. So if you guys want to enter into the community and learn more, you can just go to That’s mindfulness spelled the way that it’s spelled in English with one owl, And it’s very, very simple. You can book a call and we’ll, we’re here to be of service we’re here to help, for those that are in China, you can search, uh, we’re still on the brand Shanghai mindfulness in China.

[00:52:24] Very hard to change a wechat name. That’s another thing. Everything in China is with the extra hard. Yeah. Yeah. They’re like, but anyway, for for we chat. If you just search modernmindfulness will pop up. If that doesn’t work, you can also search Shanghai mindfulness, Shanghai mindfulness on we chat will pop up and that’s it.

[00:52:54] It’s very, very simple. And yeah. If for those listening out there, if you’re interested and mindfulness to help enhance your performance at work, or to help enhance just your mental resilience, please feel free to reach out. We’re here to help. And I just want to say to everybody out there and you guys have the most respect for you.

[00:53:18] And yeah, as, as the late loud Sue would say the journey of a thousand miles begins with a single step. So great. Thanks so much, Brendan and a it’s a pleasure, really awesome thing. And then thanks Zac for joining us today, too. All right. So, uh, thanks for having me. It’s been great hearing your story, but yeah, I mean, I know we would like, you know, the comment earlier.

[00:53:48] About it, you know, where e-commerce or business podcasts, but, you know, corporate mindfulness and, uh, mental health and stay, keeping, uh, keeping a focused mind. You know, it’s really, I mean, also of has been helping me out the last few months and it’s, I really do believe it’s helped me with getting more, worked on being more effective.

[00:54:09] You know, even though I have to, I’ve been extended, he’s been, keeps increasing the amount of time I meditate per day, you know, twice a day. I do 25 minutes, twice a day right now like that’s 50 minutes a day, almost an hour. And, uh, people will say like, how do you do that? And get your work done. I’m actually getting more.

[00:54:31] I’m doing like humongous. I mean, we built this, even all these air, meet all these sessions. We’ve been building out this whole website of calls. I mean, new projects, new new products in our Amazon, uh, business. I mean, uh, And it’s about, like you said, getting more, just being more effective with the time that you have, um, is, is what it’s about.

[00:54:54] And then another one I, I plug, I do these one minute videos and I get to see Gary Vee and uh, in Hong Kong a couple years ago. And it was asking about sleep, you know, how much sleep do you need? Cause I measure my sleep and he, sometimes I say like, You know, you got to hustle, hustle, hustle, you know, sleep when you’re dead or, you know, get shit done or whatever he would say.

[00:55:15] And then I asked him and he says, I think he got a lot of heat for that, because I think it does hurt you if you don’t sleep enough. So less than six hours, it’s really bad for you, man. I think I was. You get six hours the last year in your sixties? Oh, really? It is true. Like those old people in a park, you know, in the morning, uh, people, our age, we need about seven to eight hours a night, but, uh, he said to me in person there and I have it on video and he’s like, it’s not about how many hours you get.

[00:55:47] It’s what you do when you’re awake. And I thought that’d be a good one maybe to end today’s session with, right. Like that’s wholesome mindfulness, right. Sitting in front of a computer, working, counting your hours. Like, especially if you’re entrepreneur or a business owner, it doesn’t matter how many hours you’re like sitting in front of your computer.

[00:56:05] It’s how effective you are when you’re working. You know, whether, if you’re dead tired and it’s a 12 hour day, it doesn’t matter. But if you’re able to really be impactful, Seven or eight hours, you know, that that’s more valuable, you know, so I hope people can get that. Then. That’s what you’re, that’s what you’re doing with your, with your coaching and your training and your community.

[00:56:27] So thanks. Thanks again for sharing with ours. Uh, I hope to do more together with you, Brandon. Thanks so much. Yeah, absolutely. Thanks for having me. Thank you, Zac. Okay. Great wrap. Thank you so much for watching or listening to this show. We also have the community. We have amazing powerful. I’m really impressed with some of the people who are getting into the community and their, uh, joining and supporting and joining these live sessions and networking.

[00:56:56] You know, we’re connecting really high level people, really amazing people, nice people. And that’s really what the value of the community is. So if you want to get on the inside and see what we’re up to, he has a PO application only, and we’ll review your business. See if you’re a good fit Hope to see you inside.

[00:57:13] All right. Thank you, Brandon, for sharing. And I hope everybody enjoyed that. And Zac was really fun to have him help me out and sharing state. Actually, he sent me, helped me out with a mastermind. We’re going to do a gfavip masterminds. Now every other week, this will not be in the podcast. This will not be in our live streaming.

[00:57:30] This is private group tables with our networking software we’re using, and we put some groups together to have those people work. Together to follow their progress. Every other week, there’ll be doing an hour session as groups to, uh, help each other. Cause that’s really how I’ve grown in my business as peer pressure in positive peer pressure, not in negative peer pressure, but you need peer pressure.

[00:57:52] You need friends, you need business colleagues to share with and, and grow. So I said in the intro, I was going to share some stuff I’ve gone through with Brandon. You know, he’s been checking up with me and keeping me on track. I think one of the biggest ones for me was. Yeah. I mean, focusing on a candle because I was like all over the place and trying to do open eye meditation, which is really hard.

[00:58:13] And after I got through that, he’s cracked me up to 25 minutes, twice a day. So I’m doing almost. Almost an hour, total per day. Um, also a couple minutes breaks, uh, you know, a warm-up cool-down so yeah, it probably would be about an hour a day right now. Morning time. Right? When I wake up about 5:30 AM until about six and I do my exercise and then the new one for me that he can introduce me to his afternoons mid day, which, uh, I’ve started.

[00:58:40] I used to try to before lunch, but then what I did is, uh, I grind hard. I work so hard making these shows, making this content in the mornings. Uh, so what I do is I go right to lunch cause I’m pretty hungry. And then I’ve been doing this after lunch where I do a twenty-five minutes meditation and it’s, it’s pretty, pretty awesome.

[00:58:59] I also use insight timer. I noticed some others that people like there’s a couple other, like more famous ones, but, uh, I I’ve been using that and I got my points there and stuff like that, which helps me track my progress. And I really, I hope I hope, um, you know, that’s a little bit of tips and, you know, you realize your mind is like, I’m thinking about this and thinking like, Oh, I got to record a podcast intro.

[00:59:24] Oh, I got to work on some banking issue with my business. I got to work on customer service problems, logistics, sourcing, you know, like marketing, advertising, budgets, you know, all this stuff in my brain of all these things that’s going on. I don’t know if I’ve really said too much in a show, but we’re, we’re starting a new brand.

[00:59:42] A third new Amazon brand or e-commerce brand. And, uh, going through those horrible, stressful things about sourcing and, uh, didn’t have to bank set up any accounts set up. So it’s all this stuff’s just flying through your brain. Right. But you’re just trying to let it settle, you know, and, breathing, feel through your body and then just.

[01:00:05] Get it done, actually, it’s given me the second. So was done doing his mid day sessions. Uh, you know, it might say you don’t have time, but honestly it makes me so much more powerful in my effectiveness after that. Cause usually I’m tired of my afternoon. I used to take a nap now I don’t even take a nap and I don’t even, uh, like get, get tired.

[01:00:24] I’m like reinvigorated after these meditation sessions. So a lot of times you’ll say I don’t have to have a lot of time, but you gotta be more effective. With your time, not just have more time, but be more powerful when you’re doing that. So I hope this helped also said during a brand new session interview session was.

[01:00:44] My Maker morning and my manager afternoon. So that switched to email. I switched to all this, uh, co KKK, you know, kind of chaotic chats, things like that, and my afternoon, but it’s been really helping me out and I hope it helps you out. And I really do appreciate you listening all the way till the end. I still say listening.

[01:01:00] This is video two with my bad background, and it’s freezing cold here in Shenyang is snowing now November and, uh, you know, need, need, I’m going to get gloves because my fingers are frozen when I’m typing. But yeah. Just be more impactful, you know, don’t just work harder or longer, but be more awake and more, uh, present when you are working or doing anything.

[01:01:24] All right. That’s a wrap. Thanks so much for watching. To get more involved in running an international business. Please visit our website at That’s Also be sure to subscribe to our iTunes feed. Thanks for tuning in.

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